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Ireland shuts last coal plant, becomes 15th coal-free country in Europe (2025)

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631–640 of 712 posts

Re: Ireland shuts last coal plant, becomes 15th coal-free country in Europe (2025)

#631

https://beyondfossilfuels.org/europes-coal-exit/ keeps track of coal phase-out commitments. 24 European countries still use coal generators, and 6 have not even planned to phase them out (Serbia, Moldova, Turkey, Poland, Kosovo, Bosnia). Never used coal power: Albania, Cyprus, Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Malta, Switzerland, Norway Phased out: 2016: Belgium 2020: Sweden, Austria 2021: Portugal 2024: United…

> 2038: Germany Well, sure is good the environmentalists shut down the German nuclear plants!

> Well, sure is good the environmentalists shut down the German nuclear plants!

Shutting down the nukes is inversely proportional to homeopathy popularity in Germany. That says it all

Re: Ireland shuts last coal plant, becomes 15th coal-free country in Europe (2025)

#632
post #510

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fuel storage and reprocessing isnt where vast majority of of the cost is for nuclear power, construction and decommissioning are. These are what makes it cost 5x solar or wind.

"Decommissioning costs" are essentially bad math. Here's this again: https://www.ourworldofenergy.com/images/electrical-power-gen... Nuclear, inclusive of construction costs: ~$181/MWh, only better than natural gas because no CO2. Nuclear, cost of continuing to operate an existing reactor once it's already built: $31/MWh, basically the cheapest thing on the market, half the cost of continuing to operate an existing n…

>Decommissioning costs" are essentially bad math.

This is disingenuous. Bad math is focusing on the one part of nuclear power which is relatively cheap (fuel) and ignoring the rest where the majority of the cost is, which is what you did.

I wasnt comparing nuclear power to gas anyway I was comparing it to solar and wind which produce no CO2. FIVE times cheaper LCOE.

Nuclear power needs anyway to be paired with dispatchable energy source like batteries or gas just as solar and wind do.

It isnt a competitor with gas or batteries it is a complement to gas and batteries, just like solar and wind.

Re: Ireland shuts last coal plant, becomes 15th coal-free country in Europe (2025)

#633
post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

We've banned this account.

Cool, but late. There are tens of similar accounts active right now, and they are only banned after repeatedly and continously stepping over the line. Most of those accounts don't participate in good faith from day 1, but it takes 60-90 days for them to get banned. I don't know what to do about it, but it's a problem on HN for quite some time.

Re: Ireland shuts last coal plant, becomes 15th coal-free country in Europe (2025)

#634

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://globalenergymonitor.org/projects/global-coal-plant-t... They have more coal power plants planned and your data hickup worked out during recensions and covid.

An EV running half on coal is better than a gasoline car for carbon emissions. A similar story for heat pumps. China is more electrified than most Western nations and getting more so faster than Europe or the US: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/electricity-as-a-share-of...

> An EV running half on coal is better than a gasoline car for carbon emissions.

Source? Does that take into account full life cycle (including manufacturing)?

Re: Ireland shuts last coal plant, becomes 15th coal-free country in Europe (2025)

#635

Irish man here - Over the last few years, we've graduated from providing cheap energy to now importing most of our energy. We've seen huge energy price increases as a result. We're seeing more and more cost-of-living protests, the war now means more will suffer with fuel prices and we're still going ahead with closing down energy suppliers (this is a 2025 article but the point still stands). To anyone praising these…

Eh not sure what you're talking about.

You can see here the electricity figures in Ireland: https://app.electricitymaps.com/map/zone/IE/all/yearly

> We've graduated from providing cheap energy to now importing most of our energy. We've seen huge energy price increases as a result.

Wrong. As you can see Ireland always produced a very limited about of electricity from coal, around 11% ten years ago when wind was 10% less. In other words, wind simply replaced coal, not imports.

For the last 50 years gas provides the bulk of your electricity, but Ireland produces virtually no gas and has always imported it. The jump in prices was due to these gas prices increasing due to the Russia/Ukraine war as of 2020, it had nothing to do with import changes. Had you invested more in wind/solar, you'd be affected less.

In fact Ireland barely imports anything at all, over the last ten years the net import are close to zero. 2025 was a peak year for imports but even then imports constituted a small 13%, whereas 2024 was a year where Ireland was a net exporter, as was 2020, and 2016, 2017, 2018, 2019. In fact of the last ten years it was a net exporter 7 times, more than twice as often as the 3 years it was a net importer. And its imported when the UK has cheaper electricity prices, otherwise there'd be no reason to import.

So your entire argument isn't true. Wind/solar can beat coal on a cost-basis now, evidenced by the fact that the average existing coal plant isn't running half the time because it's more expensive, let alone building out more coal. The smartest thing to have done is mass-invest in solar/wind in a country with a population density 4x lower than the UK.

Re: Ireland shuts last coal plant, becomes 15th coal-free country in Europe (2025)

#636
post #424

I saw the data. They have replaced coal plants with gas plants. Mostly imported gas. Why do Europeans hate the idea of safe nuclear plants though? https://ember-energy.org/data/electricity-data-explorer/?cha...

Compare costs, monetary risk and TTM to renewables with battery backup. Nuclear is dead as a doornail.

Look at the nuclear buildup. Vogtle in US 10 years. Hinckley Point C is estimated to be 13 years. Flamanville 3 took 17 years. All these years you put money in and get nothing out. It's a disaster for balance sheet. Instead, you can build renewables plus batteries and have it connected within a year, generating revenue.

Re: Ireland shuts last coal plant, becomes 15th coal-free country in Europe (2025)

#637

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 2038: Germany Well, sure is good the environmentalists shut down the German nuclear plants!

Was it the environmentalists or the corrupt German government wanting to send more money to Russia for their natural gas via nordstream2

Sometimes interests intersect.

Re: Ireland shuts last coal plant, becomes 15th coal-free country in Europe (2025)

#638
post #593

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I may be wrong, but I believe the british experience with biofuels is that although you want to believe its surplus byproduct, the cheapest source is often grown to be fuel for a biofuel generator. It's like soy/corn for ethanol, it isn't sufficiently profitable to do this solely with waste product, you get better margins growing to fulfill the contract.

Even if that were the case, wouldn't it still be an essentially net-zero pollution system (disregarding small contributions from transport etc.)?

In the British case… it’s being chipped and shipped from Canada and there’s doubts it’s waste wood

It makes more sense to leave trees in the ground than burning them to generate energy

Re: Ireland shuts last coal plant, becomes 15th coal-free country in Europe (2025)

#639
post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You would have to normalize against other costs and do a deep dive to really understand. My first question would be whether electricity (commercial and residential) has become relatively more expensive than gas, beer, and other commodities. If it's the same rate then it's more of an overall inflation thing. If electricity really is far and away higher than the rest over time then one would have to look at laws, the g…

> You would have to normalize against other costs and do a deep dive to really understand. The tricky part here is that energy is an input to basically everything. It's a major (through fertiliser) input to food, and then all of transport and stocking of said food which tends to be how energy changes influence downstream inflation. So I think you'd probably need a deeper analysis to tease out these issues.

That's only in-region. Ireland imports all sorts of stuff so just look at imports if you want to exclude the energy impact on everything else.

Re: Ireland shuts last coal plant, becomes 15th coal-free country in Europe (2025)

#640

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would only be true if solar panels had be trashed and repurchased every 6 months. But instead they last > 25 years, and can be recycled rather than trashed.

No, that's wishful thinking. You can have your own opinion, but not your own facts. Engineers actually calculate all this stuff. EROEI for instance means Energy Returned on Energy Invested. For renewables, its 4. That means under ideal conditions (albino of 1, 20 year lifetime), over the lifetime of the panel you get back 4x the energy that it took to extract the materials, make the panels and install them. So if you…

I think you don't know what you're talking about.

For one the EROEI isn't 4 for renewables under ideal conditions, it differs wildly depending on the type and location and installation. It's true that for solar in Ireland (which are NOT ideal conditions) its on the low end, though still about twice as much as 4, and it's certainly not the case for wind which can have them as high as 20.

Second, I've got no clue what 'albino' is. Do you mean albedo? In that case, it's completely irrelevant for wind power. Ireland produces 20x more wind than solar, the latter is completely irrelevant in Ireland.

For solar albedo is relevant, but only if you have bifacial panels, which are still the minority.

In Spain albedo is relatively low but it has some of the highest direct sunshine hours in Europe. Albedo is high in places like the Nordics, which have fewer sunshine hours. In other words, EV is brilliant in Spain due to the abundant sun, yet surprisingly is still viable in a place like Norway precisely because of relatively high albedo, not in spite of it. This is why EROEI for solar in Spain can get up to 20. The idea that you get as much power as it took to make (EROEI of 1) is so wrong, and so obviously wrong, that it seems like you just don't have any idea what you're talking about.

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