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Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

gizmodo.com

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Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#631

Post by pas »

throwway120385 wrote: post #122
jimbob45 wrote: post #27

There was a really neat company called Digimarc[0] a while back that promised to bake the barcode into the packaging such that you could scan any part of the label and receive a barcode successfully. I have no idea what happened to them because it seemed like a slam-dunk idea that would have greatly improved the purchasing process virtually everywhere (and you could just have a traditional fallback barcode in case th…

The problem with that is the same problem with self-checkout and Amazon Dash. It's solving a problem the retailer has -- the cost of employees -- by turning shoppers into store employees. But it doesn't really solve any problems that the shopper has because scanning all of your own stuff and laying it out on the scale is so inconvenient that it ruins everything else. The only place where I've seen self-checkout be as…

Scanning is fun!

The scale sensitivity was a bit off initially, but it seems okay nowadays. (If I dropped something on the bagging area it didn't wait for the item to settle.)

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#632

Post by hoveringhen »

astura wrote: post #617
RichardCA wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> something like 'melting down discarded PCBs to recover trace metals' Better than shipbreaking. https://youtu.be/5jdEG_ACXLw

Is there a tl;dw? That's an hour long video.

Due to heavy regulations on the shipbreaking industry in Western countries, > 50% of ships worldwide are (or were, when the documentary was made) dismantled in Alang, India.

The industry is extremely polluting (to the environment and the workers) and the working conditions (incl. safety) are dire to put it nicely.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#633

Post by pas »

nickpsecurity wrote: post #257

My concerns about this were theft, mistakes, cost to operate, and opportunity costs. Theft is an obvious one. It happens in self checkouts in many ways. We had people come into our store to just leave with baskets of stuff, load their pockets, take stuff from one box to put in a cheaper one they bought, or even put raw eggs and meat in their pockets. That was with a ton of workers in the store looking out for thieves…

People can put stuff into their pockets during regular checkout too, no?

> take stuff from one box to put in a cheaper one

isn't the scale supposed to catch this?

> predicted how many registers we needed

that seems like the dumbest because No.1. useless thing in a supermarket where cashiers see the lines :D

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#634

Post by tim333 »

soderfoo wrote: post #568
smcl wrote: post #537

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the cashier won’t start scanning your items until the person in front of you has bagged all of their stuff What happens every now and then to me is that the person in front watches open mouthed as their shopping gets scanned and piles up in the bagging area, then they pay and fuck around with their purse (honestly idk what they’re doing) then take forever to pack, while the cashier starts scanning my stuff and mixe…

> the person in front watches open mouthed as their shopping gets scanned and piles up in the bagging area I feel this. It makes my blood boil. I wish I could flutter through life with such child like absent mindedness.

I've been to quite a few supermarkets where they have like a plank that separates the new shopping from the previous shoppers. Maybe advanced plank technology will spread and deal with this issue.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#635

Post by robertlagrant »

moffkalast wrote: post #601
robertlagrant wrote: post #583

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Instead of cooperation under a system with a social safety net, we get a game theoretic weighting on defection without a social safety net. There is a safety net. Here's how I'd describe the situation: There will be a number of people, fewer than the total who benefit from the safety net, who almost everyone would say it was good that they were helped. There will be a number of people, fewer than the total who bene…

> who almost everyone would say it was not good that they were helped I'm sorry, what? Only in the US helping someone can be sold as a bad thing. It's better to help a few more people that may not really need it than help a few fewer that actually did.

> I'm sorry, what? Only in the US helping someone can be sold as a bad thing. It's better to help a few more people that may not really need it than help a few fewer that actually did.

I think it's worth reading the complete comment and you'll see where what you said fits my wider point.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#636

Post by InSteady »

cammikebrown wrote: post #528
WalterBright wrote: post #510

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The local Starbucks over the years has had many turnovers in the staff. It usually takes about 3 days for a new worker to learn the job. That makes it unskilled labor. Skilled labor is something like welding, where it can take a year to get good at it. Or things that require calculus, which take 4 years of specialized training to even get an entry job at it. Or flying an airplane - you can't just flip through the ins…

How could you possibly know that it takes “3 days” to get good at being a barista? You should try it out sometime, with a 50 person line. I’m sure it’ll be a cake walk and your labor will be fairly compensated. I’ll even give you a 3 day head start just to be fair!

To be fair, Starbucks purchases machines that are automated to a much higher degree than your standard high end espresso machine you'd find in a local shop. It's a lot more button pushing in the correct sequence, a lot less art. This is standard procedure for a multinational fast food service company: they want things automated and streamlined not only for speed of service and easy training, but consistency of the product.

From what I heard from a former Starbucks barista, the biggest challenge was to not scald the milk during steaming (which is not very difficult, basically just requires holding it at the correct angle to induce a whirlpool effect and keep things moving).

The skilled aspect is dealing with customers efficiently and pleasantly, and all the nuance/craziness that can entail.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#637

Post by astura »

ScoobleDoodle wrote: post #336
WrongAssumption wrote: post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve never been nor seen anyone in the US get inspected at a self checkout. Not once.

That's because all of the self checkouts in the US use the weight change to match against the scanned item and any discrepancy leads to having to wait for a self-checkout attendant to manually override to let you continue. That manual override is equivalent to the inspection you're talking about not seeing. And I in the US get blocked needing an attendant 60%+ of the time at some point in the process. Usually up fron…

>That's because all of the self checkouts in the US use the weight change to match against the scanned item

Objectively false. Some stores in some areas do that. Most don't.

At Walmart if I only have a few items (most of the time I go to Walmart) I'll just grab the scan gun and scan everything without taking anything out of my cart. I'll bag when I get to the car.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#638

Post by tim333 »

semi-extrinsic wrote: post #277
saalweachter wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, the "if anything goes wrong you now stand around with your thumb up your ass while one employee makes their way from broken kiosk to broken kiosk to manually resolve the problems" model has soured me on self-checkout. I find I have a very low "dealing with this bullshit" limit, to the point that if I have trouble I'm likely to just say fuck it and walk out of the store without completing my purchase.

Having used the UK/US type self checkout machines while travelling, I must say it is so nice to live in Northern Europe where the self checkout machines are largely just based on trust, with randomly sampling ~five items of every 100 shoppers. There is no weighing at any of the stores. If you don't get randomly selected for inspection, there is nothing stopping you from just walking out with groceries you didn't pay…

I was disappointed when my Waitrose at Kings Cross London got rid of the non weighing machines and replaced them with regular ones. I think the non weighing ones end up costing the store more either through people nicking stuff or having to have staff watch them.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#639

Post by tim333 »

thejohnconway wrote: post #286
kevingadd wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Whole Foods location nearest to me has self-checkout stations that don't even have a scale under the bagging area. You just scan, put it in your bag and go. I assume they can afford to tank the shrinkage that results from this due to their high profit margins, or they just don't consider the costs associated with the scales to be worth it.

All the local self-checkouts where I am in London are just scan and go, no scales.

Probably a nicer area.

Re: Amazon ditches 'just walk out' checkouts at its grocery stores

#640

Post by rad_gruchalski »

onion2k wrote: post #619
rad_gruchalski wrote: post #585

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, that’s what I’m sort of saying. I haven’t failed to see any of that. But it doesn’t take a phd to make coffee politely or less politely. All I want is the coffee. Don’t ask me what my name is. I don’t care about the „experience”.

You do care about the experience though. Everyone does. If you have a bad experience you'll complain, or stop going to that Starbucks, or moan to your friends. To you, by the sounds of things, a good experience consists of asking for your order, paying, and getting out fast. An experienced retail worker will be able to read all that from your cues - not engaging in small talk, having your payment ready, moving along…

I don't go to Starbucks anyway because they just keep that stupid ritual of "what's your name" and they can never understand what I'm saying so we are just standing there on the opposite side of the counter exercising our knowledge of the military alphabet. If that's the sort of skill required, sorry, anyone can do it. Tell me - how long does it take to serve your first coffee at Starbucks as a barista?

Just sell me the damn coffee and bugger off with "experience". It doesn't require a "skilled" person to politely serve me a coffee. Just make sure the coffee doesn't taste like shit and I'll come back to you unless you spit at me or offend me. Again - no need to be "skilled" to not do that.

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