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Mass timber is great, but it will not solve the housing shortage

construction-physics.com

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Re: Mass timber is great, but it will not solve the housing shortage

#631

Post by decafninja »

mlsu wrote: post #600
LunaSea wrote: post #564

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You described hell.

If Tokyo is hell why did so many people choose to move there?

You cannot replicate the Tokyo (or Seoul, or Taipei, or Singapore, or Hong Kong) model in the US without making certain societal choices that are either impossible or unpalatable here. We will never have anything remotely as nice as the Tokyo transit system for that reason.

I love taking the Tokyo subways whenever I visit. I make it a point to avoid the NYC subway if at all possible.

Re: Mass timber is great, but it will not solve the housing shortage

#632

Post by gottorf »

lizknope wrote: post #628
majormajor wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can easily get housing affordability crises even without single family homes, as is plainly evident right now in non-North-American cities. It's a bit of a red herring. You end up sitting in traffic for an hour instead of standing on a bus or train for an hour for your commute, and other knock-on differences like that, which can be debated for various other reasons like ecological impact, but you still end up run…

People are attacking single family homes and commuter culture. Okay, but my solution is different. The pandemic showed that millions of us can work from home. My office was closed for about 2 years. Our stock price shot way up. There were lots of stories about the environmental benefits. Air pollution in big cities decreased dramatically. Wildlife started returning in places. We keep building commercial real estate a…

> Our stock price shot way up.

This would imply that a company's stock price is directly influenced by its productive output; in reality, it's only very tangentially so. Especially for low-profit, high-growth tech companies, I'd wager the federal funds rate's effect on the stock price is way higher.

Re: Mass timber is great, but it will not solve the housing shortage

#633

Post by closeparen »

advael wrote: post #450

I think this article is a great example of how technical people have become so intoxicated by the relatively few instances in which an advance in technology has genuinely solved an entrenched social or power problem by making a new thing possible or reducing costs that they basically only argue in those terms The fact is, the housing crisis is and always was a policy failure and a "distributional outcomes" issue, and…

Where to even start with this? Homes occupied by renters are not being "hoarded." At most this is a concern about homeownership rate, which is not nothing, but a distant second to whether people have places to live or not. Because rents are tethered to incomes, the rental market is a relief valve for speculative excesses in the ownership market. That's why it costs less than half as much to rent as to buy the same property in San Francisco right now. Landlords are not getting a return from collecting rent, they're getting a return from appreciation due to scarcity. And the more concerned voters get about capitalism and inequality, the surer a bet that scarcity becomes.

Re: Mass timber is great, but it will not solve the housing shortage

#634

Post by sandworm101 »

oblio wrote: post #479
sandworm101 wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Everyone has their own bar, restaurant, theatre, and community center. As opposed to all the "urban lifestyle" people who readily offload their basic needs onto others. Some people are happy cooking their own basic foods. Others want them to be prepared, and their dished cleaned, by a team. Some people are happy with a beer fridge. Others want to go to a bar and pay a young person to smile and flirt while concocti…

Beer fridge? Is that supposed to be a fridge just for beers?

Yes. Generally kept in a garage or other place away from the kitchen. Beer is bought in bulk and kept cold for parties. It is just a cheap fridge without any bells and whistles. It is a real thing in much of the US.

Re: Mass timber is great, but it will not solve the housing shortage

#635

Post by imgabe »

All of the construction related solutions to housing problems are missing the point. Housing is not expensive because it's difficult to physically build. We are pretty good at construction. A single family home could probably be put up in two weeks or less if all that mattered was doing the actual construction.

The problem is zoning and all the red tape and NIMBYism that prevents the construction from taking place.

Re: Mass timber is great, but it will not solve the housing shortage

#636

Post by [deleted] »

Ar-Curunir wrote: post #588
dingnuts wrote: post #546

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if you're in decent health and if you're not? Not all bad health is a character failure, you know. Some people just have diseases like multiple sclerosis in the public vs private transit discussion, all I know is that I've never been harassed by someone else in my car on the way to work, but the subway was a different story, and I've spent a lot more time commuting by car than train

If you’re not, you use a car, or maybe priority seating. Nobody is saying ban cars, but make them unnecessary for the average person.

[deleted]

Re: Mass timber is great, but it will not solve the housing shortage

#637

Post by bluGill »

shortsunblack wrote: post #559
bluGill wrote: post #520

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep reading that claim. Then I look at old streetcar suburbs which have successfully a repaired thier roads over decades (including removing the old tracks). They have also added water, sewer, electric, phone, catv since being built. which is to say it doesn't pass the smell test. I don't know where the studies go wrong but something isn'c adding up.

Old streetcar suburbs are much denser than typical American suburb today due to increased setbacks, lot coverage rates and other factors. But yes, even streetcar suburbs get subsidized back then. The subsidy is just more productive in it opening economic mobility with cheap, carbon neutral transport, depending on your views on rail transport.

lots are the same size today, or maybe slightly smaller. back then everone had a garden which took up space.

Re: Mass timber is great, but it will not solve the housing shortage

#638

Post by deadbabe »

foxyv wrote: post #177

It takes significantly less materials to build a multi-dwelling apartment/condo/townhouse structure than a single family home. In addition, the required square footage per person drops by huge amounts when people can walk to nearby community centers, restaurants, kitchens, theaters, and bars. We are building massive 3-4k sq. ft. homes for families of four because all of their food, entertainment, and social needs are…

Stop trying to imply we should be in these 600 sqft shoeboxes where the only escape is to go outside in a dirty urban city and walk around.

I want a large home I can decorate, with lots of light to keep me happy, and space to invite friends and host a variety of activities, a garden I can tend to and see animals, or just be at peace enjoying the quiet tranquility of not being attached to a neighbor.

If I had no choice but to live stuck in a tiny apartment all my life – I’d just kill myself.

Re: Mass timber is great, but it will not solve the housing shortage

#639

Post by nradov »

mlsu wrote: post #599
nradov wrote: post #552

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people who currently live in San Francisco/San Jose don't particularly want to turn it into a global metropolis and don't give a damn about abstract concepts like "cultural relevance". Cultural elitists should have some humility and not presume that they know best. Another option would be to set policies that encourage greater economic development and job growth in Stockton so that residents aren't forced to com…

Most people move to the Bay to get a good job, which is only possible in a large, vibrant, globally connected city. Everyone -- every single person -- who buys or rents a house in the SF bay today does so because they either have or want have "a good job." Is there a single person alive who has bought a house on the peninsula recently because it's a quiet place where nothing much happens? The Bay Area is extremely sp…

Are you being sarcastic or do you actually believe that nonsense? There are a huge number of places outside the SF Bay Area that have good jobs available. Lots of openings in North Dakota for good oil and gas production jobs. Plenty of high paying work in Cleveland for anyone with healthcare skills. The list goes on and on.

Personally I wouldn't want to live in SF proper even if it was cheap. Most of the city is kind of a shithole and the governance is atrocious in a way that goes far beyond just failed housing policies.

Re: Mass timber is great, but it will not solve the housing shortage

#640

Post by lizknope »

gottorf wrote: post #632
lizknope wrote: post #628

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People are attacking single family homes and commuter culture. Okay, but my solution is different. The pandemic showed that millions of us can work from home. My office was closed for about 2 years. Our stock price shot way up. There were lots of stories about the environmental benefits. Air pollution in big cities decreased dramatically. Wildlife started returning in places. We keep building commercial real estate a…

> Our stock price shot way up. This would imply that a company's stock price is directly influenced by its productive output; in reality, it's only very tangentially so. Especially for low-profit, high-growth tech companies, I'd wager the federal funds rate's effect on the stock price is way higher.

My company's profits were up in 2020-21 and then we went back to the office in 2022 and our profits and stock price dropped. We had 500 openings in 2020-21 and then we laid off 8% of the employees in 2023.

I joke in meetings that we just need to go back home and we will make more money.

I work for a fabless semiconductor company that makes chips for data centers and other applications, not a software company.

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