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Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

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Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#631

Post by stale2002 »

lttlrck wrote: post #622
stale2002 wrote: post #525

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> EPIC is forced to accept that Apple is complying with the DMA. No they don't. They are absolutely still able to start a lawsuit, as is the EU. We likely won't have to wait more than a couple weeks to see the lawsuits filed.

until that lawsuit is filed and we have a judgement, yes, they are.

> until that lawsuit is filed

So then this would be the process of not accepting Apple's interpretation of the DMA.

Thats my point. That is the exact process for which they would be rejecting Apple's interpretation.

So no, they don't have to accept Apple's interpretation, instead they can go through this process.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#632

Post by perlclutcher »

ein0p wrote: post #626
agust wrote: post #585

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So? They removed them without any announcement for two weeks (hoping no one would notice), then officially announced it on their website when the backlash was growing. They then backed down after Open Web Advocacy ran surveys, an open letter and the EU started a investigation.

Why would they announce if it's a beta? For all we know it could have been a bug or something, or an unfinished attempt to change it in some ways. I'm having a hard time imagining Apple just willy nilly nuking a fairly prominent feature many people use. Including myself, by the way.

[dead]

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#634

Post by vikramkr »

jfoster wrote: post #429
overgard wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely just Apple trying to save face. Without the threat of fines and lengthy legal proceedings Apple would not have cared about "epic's commitment to follow the rules"

Difficult to imagine what Apple were thinking in the first place. Did they actually think there was a chance the EU would let this slide? Best I can tell, all they've achieved is bringing even greater scrutiny on themselves.

Why wouldn't you think the EU would let that slide? Until recently all they've done is fine these companies amounts of money that are nice for headlines but not really that painful. Regulators with teeth is - new for apple

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#635

Post by rekoil »

idle_zealot wrote: post #488
Dalewyn wrote: post #441

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Business is an at-will arrangement, at least in the free parts of the world. If Apple straight up doesn't want to do business with Epic and can even point to prior breaches and violations of terms as justification, more power to them. Remember the classic and often seen disclaimer: "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone." >versus breaking a ToS that's forced upon you. Epic wasn't forced to sign anything.

> If Apple straight up doesn't want to do business with Epic and can even point to prior breaches and violations of terms as justification, more power to them. This would be true, if Apple hadn't positioned themselves as gatekeeper to running software on a significant portion of the world's personal computers. If Apple wants full say over who they do business with all it has to do is allow its users to install softwa…

Exactly, do that and they're then free to set whatever rules they want on their App Store.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#636

Post by SR2Z »

freedomben wrote: post #482
tpmoney wrote: post #471

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not whether Apple will, it's the other developers that you might not have a choice to interact with. Sure, in the tech space, we're all imagining the great open source on iOS revolution. Gamers are anticipating their Fortnite. And I'm sure Facebook is anticipating not having to ask for permission to hoover up all your personal data. Sure you don't need facebook, but if you want to be using WhatsApp to communicat…

That would certainly be an interesting turn of events if major apps like Facebook or Whatsapp decided to d-list from the app store and require their own store. Given Apple's current heavy fees and disincentives to do that, I'm guessing epic is probably the only company that will. I think a lot of people would refuse to install an alternative app store to get most apps. But most of all, I look at Android where alterna…

Android app stores failed because there's actually not much of a need for middlemen: you can just get an APK from the source, like you would on Windows.

As far as I can tell, Apple doesn't plan to let this happen.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#637

Post by SR2Z »

NekkoDroid wrote: post #606
dkjaudyeqooe wrote: post #520

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not? They tell US car makers what their products should do. The same for fruit growers, clothes makers and thousands of other businesses selling into the common market. It's called regulation and it's a normal part of modern life. We're a society of laws and they apply equally to everyone. If you don't like the laws either vote accordingly, talk to your representative, organise a political action, or leave for a…

I find it funny them bringing up aviation companies when it feels like every month Boeing appears in the news for something falling off their plan while in flight, be it doors or wheels. That is what happens when you let companies "do what ever they want" and mind you aviation is VERY REGULATED.

The regulatory regime for Boeing has not changed; Boeing has.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#638

Post by agust »

ein0p wrote: post #626
agust wrote: post #585

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So? They removed them without any announcement for two weeks (hoping no one would notice), then officially announced it on their website when the backlash was growing. They then backed down after Open Web Advocacy ran surveys, an open letter and the EU started a investigation.

Why would they announce if it's a beta? For all we know it could have been a bug or something, or an unfinished attempt to change it in some ways. I'm having a hard time imagining Apple just willy nilly nuking a fairly prominent feature many people use. Including myself, by the way.

You seem particularly willing to ignore the facts in order to paint Apple's actions in a good light.

Apple releases developer notes containing changes included in its betas. Such a change should obviously have appeared right away when iOS 17.4 beta 1 was released. It did not.

After two weeks of backlash, Apple did confirm it was removing the feature in a public statement. They just did not want to announce it publicly before.

After two other weeks of bigger backlash and the start of an EU investigation, they publicly announced they would not remove the feature after all.

They 100% intended to remove the feature, and 100% backed down.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#639

Post by fragmede »

leptons wrote: post #534
fragmede wrote: post #487

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also, Apple out their foot down against carrier nonsense This is the main point, not the "also". Apple's revolution was actually getting it in the hands of real life consumers who paid for cell phone plans. The tech was already there with blackberry, but you had to have business to afford it. Yes, the original iPhone itself was a technical marvel, but it would have been a dead fish if it wasn't for the at& t deal t…

>the original iPhone itself was a technical marvel Apple didn't invent anything in the original iPhone, except the software. And the first version was really lacking and very buggy. https://finance.yahoo.com/news/steve-jobs-rigged-first-iphon... Other phones that predated the iPhone release had more capabilities and more software. There was nothing really "marvelous" about the original iPhone, it was many years behin…

You're right. The "technical marvel" of the iPhone was the size of its battery. Treo's and Blackberry's were already there with the hardware. But the software. Apple's pretty good with software, so their implementation also made a difference.

Re: Epic says Apple will reinstate developer account

#640

Post by usr1106 »

jncfhnb wrote: post #479
usr1106 wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vendor lock-in is what wecall it in the IT-sector.

Not really. Gatekeeping is applied because you must pay Apple the tax to access its customers; not use its tech.

I saw it from end-customer perspective. Somebody who buys an Apple device cannot choose other app stores, nearly the same with Android.
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