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'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

aljazeera.com

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Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#631

Post by boppo1 »

nradov wrote: post #446
ido wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you, Dang. As someone on the Israeli left I feel like I'm between a rock and a hard place- I do not condone Netanyahu and his government and am indeed very critical of Israeli governments of the past decades. But on the other side, my 78 year old mother is fleeing to shelter every couple hours as my hometown (not anywhere near the west bank or the Gaza strip) gets hit by rockets, as do my young nieces and nephe…

Israelis can potentially vote out Netanyahu in the next election. But how exactly would you propose to remove Hamas from power without a lot of civilian deaths? Hamas leadership prefers the current state of affairs because it has made them wealthy by taxing the populace and embezzling foreign aid. They have no incentive to agree to a peace deal or allow new multiparty elections. There doesn't appear to be any realist…

Is there any way Israel could undermine Hamas with prosperity? Make the lives of palestinians better, give back settlements, etc? Get average palestinians to think "wtf who are these terrorist asshats, Israel is a good neighbor."

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#632

Post by dang »

2OEH8eoCRo0 wrote: post #542
dang wrote: post #2

All: if you're going to comment in this thread, please do not do so in the spirit of battle. The latter is off topic here, and the last thread HN had about this did not do well enough at keeping to the site guidelines: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html . Instead, ask first whether you can find a place of compassion in yourself before commenting. If you can't, that's understandable, but then please don'…

Did pg ask you to resurrect this flamebait thread?

No.

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#633

Post by bjourne »

neoromantique wrote: post #554
bjourne wrote: post #456

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's also not forget the unbearable plight of all Russian HNers, who due to circumstances beyond their control are now isolated from the rest of the world. Many of them suffer greatly and fear for their own lives as Ukrainian drone attacks hit deep into Russian territory. We shouldn't treat this situation as a football match, where people only support "their" side. Instead, peaceful coexistence with both sides fulfi…

You might be coming from a good place, but you are word for word posting Kremlin talking points currently being pushed all over the place through their think tanks. Minsk agreements were impossible to uphold and Russia never attempted to do so from the beginning, it was showed upon then much weaker Ukraine as Ukraine was in no position to defend itself then, it is different now.

Sure, it's satire. My point was that if this article was about how Russian prisons brutalize Ukrainian children, dang probably wouldn't have posted asking for us to show compassion with the perpetrators' side.

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#634

Post by Yasuraka »

asylteltine wrote: post #572
l3mure wrote: post #510

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Hamas intentionally mixes their forces with civilians This is the entire point of mandatory Israeli military service and aggressive illegal settlements/settlers protected by the IDF.

[flagged]

By the end of the 16th century, the Ottoman Empire had the largest Jewish population in the world, as it provided a principal place of refuge for Jews driven out of Western Europe by massacres and persecution.

Your frame of reference includes the last 70 years, but not the 1880 years prior starting from 70 CE?

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#635

Post by h3rsko »

r00fus wrote: post #418
drc500free wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Al Jazeera is state propaganda run by the Qataris, who also fund Hamas. The one topic that they absolutely cannot provide unbiased commentary on is Israel-Palestine. Picking an AJ article as the jumping off point is akin to picking a Pravda or RT article as the jumping off point to discuss Ukraine-Russia. I think this community is better than most at keeping things analytical, and you're better than any other moderat…

This is conjecture, not facts. Please provide some actual reason why one should see Al Jazeera as a non-serious source. btw, the same was said about the Al Jazeera's reporting on the Iraq occupation, and it was equally false.

They still claim the al-Ahli hospital explosion was an Israeli strike where "hundreds were killed."

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/10/20/what-have-open-sou...

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#636

Post by nahumfarchi »

bjornsing wrote: post #485
nahumfarchi wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I don't think that is a reasonable take at all. 1. This is warfare, not civil law. Hamas, which is the sovereign in Gaza (there has been no Israeli military presence there for years), commited an act of war in which hundreds were killed, raped, and kidnapped. Israel, as a state, has the moral duty to fight back and make sure this never happens again. Otherwise, it breaks the most basic contract between citizen an…

> Israel, as a state, has the moral duty to fight back and make sure this never happens again. This is often said and I’m sure often in good faith, but I always find it a bit unsettling. If by “making sure it never happens again” you mean stronger protection of the boarder going forward it’s fine of course. But if you’re referring to someone kind of offensive operation (as I assume most who say this are, since they a…

We've tried defense, didn't work out. Which laws of armed conflict are you specifically referring to?

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#637

Post by acdha »

amanaplanacanal wrote: post #126
srackey wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why is Israel’s reaction worse? They seem to be reacting to an unprovoked attack by an openly genocidal neighbor with a pretty big-standard conventional war to eliminate the problem regime. I’m not saying that Israel couldn’t be more mindful of optics or civilian casualties, but how is this war not justified?

This war didn’t start on September 7th. It’s been going on longer than any of us have been alive. The atrocities on both sides are horrible, and I feel sorry for the civilians on both sides who are just trying to live their lives. Unfortunately the Israeli government has all the power here, and they have been completely unable to find a solution over, now, decades. The blockade of Gaza and expanding settlements in th…

> Unfortunately the Israeli government has all the power here, and they have been completely unable to find a solution over, now, decades

Unable, or unwilling. The most damaging political assassination in history after Franz Ferdinand was probably when Yitzhak Rabin was assassinated because he was too close to a peace treaty.

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#638

Post by aluminum96 »

jacooper wrote: post #465
anovick wrote: post #63

[flagged]

[flagged]

> but that doesn't matter to you, does it

With this ad hominem attack, you are contributing toxicity, and it makes having a nuanced online discussion about Israel-Palestine impossible.

The parent comment is lodging a factual, falsifiable complaint.

IMO this topic should be banned on HN, and this is why.

Re: 'Like we were lesser humans': Gaza boys, men recall Israeli arrest, torture

#639

Post by monocasa »

EvgeniyZh wrote: post #342
qwertthrowway wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think an honest answer would be to end occupation and oppression of the Palestinians by Israel. Any occupying force has an interest to silence and stop indigenous people from claiming their land rights. For example, Gaza had been described as an open air prison for almost 2 decades because its borders, imports, sea usage, had all been controlled by Israel. This is not what we call “sovereign rule”. The West Bank ha…

Gaza has border with Egypt not controlled by Israel. In fact, ~150k people left Gaza in 2022, and numbers from 2023 are of similar scale [1]. I wouldn't call it a prison [1] https://twitter.com/Aizenberg55/status/1665745935589076992

The Rafah crossing is effectively controlled by Israel as well. Egypt gets ~$1.5B/yr in defense aid from the US ever since the six day war in exchange for playing nice with Israel. That has been interpreted by Egypt to mean including Israel in decisions regrading the Rafah crossing and enforcing the Israeli blockade there.
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