Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem • Hacker News Board

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#631

Post by function_seven » Mon, Sep 25, 2023, 10:47 PM UTC

Waterluvian wrote: post #478

jll29 wrote: post #462

Writing/editing worked fine on my Blackberry. It's the people who introduced the glass surface keyboards that are the root of the editing evil. Cursor keys to edit, a scroll wheel to navigate one's inbox, it was a dream that "they" stole from us with RIM's demise.

I’m so much faster with touch than I ever was on my BB. But your comment made me realize how much I’d love a jog wheel where my right index finger rests (top right side) while my thumbs are typing. I’d use it for adjusting the cursor location or press in to select a word for replacement. Ooouhhh… imagining this already feels right.

What you're describing is how my very first cellphone (a Sony PCS phone, model CM-B1201SPR) operated. It was awesome, and I distinctly remember the mini-grieving I did when I replaced that phone with a Nokia. Snake was cool, but I missed that jog wheel!

And yeah, imagining it already feels right to me as well. I just picked up my iPhone and imagined how cool it would be if Apple took their digital crown, flipped it sideways, and submerged it into the edge of the phone. Sure, waterproofing might be tricky, but they figure that out for other penetrations through the case, so I have faith.

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#632

Post by jakub_g » Mon, Sep 25, 2023, 10:52 PM UTC

laurentlb wrote: post #222

fisian wrote: post #8

My biggest problem in editing on mobile is changing a text selection (for example a long URL or long text paragraphs) that don't fit on screen at once. Once I have to scroll (vertically or, even worse, horizontally) in addition to moving the selection handles the UX is just terrible.

Came here to say the same: editing a URL is very painful. I wish I could use a multiline editor for the URL.

My URL editing routine on Android:

- copy the URL to clipboard

- open "Fast Notepad" app, paste

- edit, copy, paste

I agree, URL editing is infuriating especially with long URLs with massive tracking query strings (e.g. anything opened from Facebook). But not only. Sometimes I want to change subdomain of a long URL (e.g. from reddit to old.reddit) and it requires a lot of scrolling to the left.

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#633

Post by jakub_g » Mon, Sep 25, 2023, 11:05 PM UTC

phreack wrote: post #529

> Whenever I explain my research at Google into mobile text editing, I’m usually met with blank stares or a slightly hostile “Everyone can edit text on their phones, right? What’s the problem?” These people must have never used a phone. This article hits 100%, there's quite a lot of these micro-issues on things we use constantly that could be major differentiators and extremely easy sells, but no one implements. My v…

Opera Android supports reflow FWIW. Needs to be enabled in settings (appearance > accessibility)

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#634

Post by phreack » Mon, Sep 25, 2023, 11:22 PM UTC

jakub_g wrote: post #633

phreack wrote: post #529

> Whenever I explain my research at Google into mobile text editing, I’m usually met with blank stares or a slightly hostile “Everyone can edit text on their phones, right? What’s the problem?” These people must have never used a phone. This article hits 100%, there's quite a lot of these micro-issues on things we use constantly that could be major differentiators and extremely easy sells, but no one implements. My v…

Opera Android supports reflow FWIW. Needs to be enabled in settings (appearance > accessibility)

Yes! I'd rather not use it because it doesn't support uBlock but it's a feature I can't browse without. I try every other browser at least once every year and they're all massively uncomfortable.

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#635

Post by dundarious » Mon, Sep 25, 2023, 11:39 PM UTC

hutzlibu wrote: post #621

dundarious wrote: post #599

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given 2 finger pinch-spread is already taken for zoomout-zoomin, what are the remaining useful combinations for 3 fingers? It can't detect which finger you're using. It should support one-handed operation, so the 3 finger gesture should be possible with one hand. You'll likely have to use middle and ring fingers, which are mechanically connected, so relative motion would be difficult. I think you're wrong. There are…

"You'll likely have to use middle and ring fingers" Well, people who played the violin or alike can do this, but yeah, it was hard work to learn and cannot be expected of the general user. So yes, it cannot be anything complicated. One of my ideas is to use the position of the fingers and the timing they touch. No matter which finger, what matters is the position they touch down relative to each other. So 2 (or 3) to…

I like playing music and enjoyed the multitouch puzzle game posted on HN a while back, so for a game like the one you're suggesting, fair enough.

For text editing, I don't think the cardinality of the set of gesture-based solutions is very large.

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#636

Post by failuser » Mon, Sep 25, 2023, 11:52 PM UTC

dieortin wrote: post #629

crazygringo wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Holy crap. I've been using the space bar for years to move the cursor, I had no idea you could select with it too. Thank you! It's even officially documented as well [1]. I wonder if selection was introduced when the spacebar cursor was, or if it was later. [1] https://support.apple.com/guide/iphone/type-with-the-onscree...

Selection was introduced at the same time as “space bar cursor”, which is with the introduction of 3D Touch in the iPhone 6s. Actually, it wasn’t even a “space bar cursor”, as the way of triggering it was with force pressing and not by holding the space bar. It works much better with 3D Touch, as you can move the cursor around and press harder without lifting to start selecting, then release a bit to stop. My iPhone…

I miss 3D Touch too, it was faster than waiting for a long tap.

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#637

Post by failuser » Mon, Sep 25, 2023, 11:53 PM UTC

savoyard wrote: post #477

bombela wrote: post #432

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Press F6 in firefox for caret browsing.

That would be F7. The same works in Chrome.

Thanks, that comes in very useful from time to time. I thought that got disabled. Chrome did double checked that I know what I’m doing with a popup, I hope this is not a sign this will get deprecated.

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#638

Post by dTal » Tue, Sep 26, 2023, 12:14 AM UTC

matheusmoreira wrote: post #611

dTal wrote: post #501

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wrote programs on my calculator in high school, an ostensibly narrowly focused device with computing power generously estimated at well under 1% that of your phone, made by a company that didn't really give two shits about their device's programming community. Therefore, it's hard not to come to the conclusion that if someone as dedicated as you is struggling to write programs for your phone, on your phone, it's be…

> Can you not find a real computer that's comfortable to use in bed? Real computers are not made for that. I don't think there's a comfortable way to use a keyboard and mouse while lying down. I had better luck trying to find a bed for use with computers instead of the other way around. Even that was extremely difficult. I'd need an over bed or zero gravity workstation that's more expensive than the computer itself.…

>I don't think there's a comfortable way to use a keyboard and mouse while lying down.

If a genie appeared and gave me one wish right now, I would wish for everyone in the world to get a free GPD Micro PC. Plus a spare one.

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#639

Post by thejazzman » Tue, Sep 26, 2023, 12:32 AM UTC

Woshiwuja wrote: post #554

lolinder wrote: post #487

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find that typing on a phone (iPhone or Android) these days is substantially easier than typing on an iPad because of swipe. It's still nowhere as efficient as a keyboard in the hands of a skilled typist, but I can often produce text fast enough that it isn't worth getting out my laptop. On an iPad it's far worse, because I actually do have to use the bad QWERTY touchscreen key-by-key. What I keep hoping for as far…

Swipe is terrible and i dont know how people even use it

Which phone do you have? I think it works great on the Mini, but I believe I recall it being a disappointment on a Max

Re: Text editing on mobile: the invisible problem

#640

Post by MattRix » Tue, Sep 26, 2023, 2:34 AM UTC

awinter-py wrote: post #578

MattRix wrote: post #511

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just tried and got 72wpm with 97% accuracy without looking… though honestly I think not looking is a bit pointless, since the keyboard is so close to the text anyway. It’s not nearly as jarring as looking at your keyboard when typing on a desktop.

fwiw: 46wpm 80% droid, 31wpm 80% iphone S, 120wpm 98% laptop 47wpm 86% droid with glide disabled (but I'm not dissing glide, it just gets in the way in pure-tap situations)

Yeah your laptop/desktop speed is faster than mine, I’m somewhere between 100-120wpm there. I wonder if my faster phone speed is due to my weird typing style where I use my left thumb and my right index finger? heh