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2022 Ford F-150 Lightning

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Re: 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning

#631

Post by mywittyname »

Drunk_Engineer wrote: post #499
a2tech wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a few friends that are engineers in the auto companies. Its kind of amazing how many negative impacts the CAFE standards had--not on purpose (hopefully), but through unintended consequences. Apparently the Nissan Leaf for example was strictly manufactured to generate credits/offset the environmental impact of the Nissan truck and van line that could not be adjusted to meet the CAFE standards. My dad had a Rang…

The "negative" impacts of CAFE standards were entirely by design. They were written that way to benefit the domestic auto industry, which is very uncompetitive in the small and midsized vehicle segments. By making smaller vehicles uncompetitive (or simply unavailable), it eliminated some serious competition.

I think a lot of people don't realize how many regulations are designed by incumbent domestic companies explicitly for the purposes of making foreign companies and upstarts noncompetitive.

You're right that CAFE is literally designed to favor trucks. And the definition is so vague that even vehicles like the PT Cruiser are considered Light Trucks for the purposes of CAFE. It is also designed to hurt small cars, because vehicles with footprints (wheelbase * wheel wide) smaller than a Mustang (literally, to the square inch) have to face ever-more-strict CAFE standards.

As a result, cars like the Fit are might face a CAFE penalty while a base F150 does a-okay despite getting like half the fuel economy. And that's not even getting into BS like flex fuel credits (basically, being flex fuel capable is like adding ~5mpg to the vehicle CAFE score).

This is exactly why every small vehicle is a crossover anymore (they are light trucks for CAFE purposes), and why cars like the Civic get are today, the size an Accord was in 2005 (CAFE is less strict the larger the vehicle is).

Re: 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning

#632

Post by linuxhiker »

avereveard wrote: post #589
dboreham wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Story from when we moved to Montana 20 years ago: We buy a freezer at Costco. Checking out, we ask for details on delivery. Costco employee says "Oh, we don't deliver". We had been used to Costco in CA which at the time would deliver large items. I ask "Well, how do people get big things like freezers home". Costco person says "Easy, just put it in your pickup, we'll help you load". "Hmm...we don't own a pickup". Cos…

or, you know, rentals, no need to drop 20 grands on a pickup to get a fridge home

Better 20 grand for a truck than a prius

Re: 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning

#634

Post by GordonS »

avidphantasm wrote: post #434
dboreham wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Story from when we moved to Montana 20 years ago: We buy a freezer at Costco. Checking out, we ask for details on delivery. Costco employee says "Oh, we don't deliver". We had been used to Costco in CA which at the time would deliver large items. I ask "Well, how do people get big things like freezers home". Costco person says "Easy, just put it in your pickup, we'll help you load". "Hmm...we don't own a pickup". Cos…

Or just rent a pickup when you need it for $50 a day? Fancy-boy pickups easily cost upwards of $50k.

Yep, here in the UK for very rare occasions we need to move something big (like, once every 1-2 years), we just hire a pickup or van for £50-70 depending on size. Even a small lorry with a tail lift is only £100 for 24h.

Seems like madness to buy something as big as a pickup and drag round that weight (with the poor MPG that comes with it) and deal with parking such a behemoth, all for something you do so rarely *

* obviously if you're a farmer or running a business or something, that's different - but that's not what this thread is about.

Re: 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning

#635

Post by hourislate »

sharkweek wrote: post #397
dboreham wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Story from when we moved to Montana 20 years ago: We buy a freezer at Costco. Checking out, we ask for details on delivery. Costco employee says "Oh, we don't deliver". We had been used to Costco in CA which at the time would deliver large items. I ask "Well, how do people get big things like freezers home". Costco person says "Easy, just put it in your pickup, we'll help you load". "Hmm...we don't own a pickup". Cos…

Here in Seattle, I have one close friend with a pickup, everyone else drives Subarus (no exception). But in all seriousness, he gets asked about 1.5x a week if someone can borrow his truck, it's insane how far this "ask" stretches itself. It drives him a little bonkers, but he's also a pretty nice guy so he says yes more than he should. Anyways, I'd probably buy a smaller pickup because of how often my partner buys a…

Uhaul rents pickups for $20 a day plus mileage in Seattle. Let your friend know so he can point everyone there.

Re: 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning

#636

Post by dcolkitt »

bb123 wrote: post #97
CalRobert wrote: post #8

It's great to see the best selling vehicle in the US be zero emissions. It's wonderful. But this truck will be very heavy, very tall, and very fast. Drivers are already the leading killers of children, and more and more people are being killed while walking and cycling. I'm very worried about the effect of making this vehicle even faster and heavier. Hopefully reduced deaths from pollution offset this.

Electric vehicles often have much better safety credentials than their ICE powered counterparts for a few reasons: * All of the weight is in the bottom of the vehicle, giving a lower centre of gravity. I'd bet this will kill the old F150 in a moose (or child!) test. * The lack of engine means the entire front part of the car is a huge crumple zone. This gives designers more wriggle room for pedestrian protection too.…

> Switching our road transport to electric will probably save more children, and the adults they will become, from a lifetime of lung problems and premature death from pollution

The sizable majority of modern car pollution comes from particulates that come off asphalt, not emissions from engines. It's still important to go EV to reduce carbon, but that doesn't improve local air quality. Modern internal combustion engines have pretty minimal pollutants in their emissions.

Getting older cars off the road is the major way to improve emission pollutants. Beyond that, improving air quality to any significant degree requires either fewer cars on the road, or less heavy cars on the road. Asphalt particulates scales quadratically with the weight of the car.

Re: 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning

#637

Post by calabin »

jacurtis wrote: post #449
kgermino wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pickups are convenient any many (probably most) owners have them for good reasons, but living in a Midwestern city I run into so many "bad" pickup drivers it's hard not to get frustrated with them generally. A lot of people around here have big, tall pickups with tiny beds that they drive very aggressively. They rarely use them for anything I couldn't put in my Fit (I've known several people who would never haul dirt…

> Many modern pickups have a high front grill that is dangerous for pedestrians and designed to be intimidating I get what you are trying to say, but had to mention that all front grills of vehicles are dangerous to pedestrians. It's just a bit of a strawman argument to say "Well when I hit people with my car it will be worse if I own a truck, so I'm going to own a Prius so that the pedestrians roll right off".

I think the argument is less that the grill on a truck is especially bad in the case of a pedestrian collision, and more that the limited forward visibility provided by a high front grill results in a greater likelihood of not seeing pedestrians directly in your vehicle's path.

Re: 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning

#638

Post by doytch »

rcMgD2BwE72F wrote: post #592
dboreham wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Story from when we moved to Montana 20 years ago: We buy a freezer at Costco. Checking out, we ask for details on delivery. Costco employee says "Oh, we don't deliver". We had been used to Costco in CA which at the time would deliver large items. I ask "Well, how do people get big things like freezers home". Costco person says "Easy, just put it in your pickup, we'll help you load". "Hmm...we don't own a pickup". Cos…

>We buy a freezer at Costco. Checking out, we ask for details on delivery. Costco employee says "Oh, we don't deliver". We had been used to Costco in CA which at the time would deliver large items. I every one owns a pickup, why don't you simply rent one (à la Airbnb, e.g with GetAround) for just a day? I've never owned a vehicle (other than a bicycle, but I live in Paris) but can easily rent any kind of car/truck/va…

Generally it's the hassle of getting it because in car-centric American cities, the rent-for-a-day renting process isn't streamlined. Rental companies aren't convenient (or possible) to walk/bus to so you need to get there somehow. Which means you need a main car already, or you have to bug a neighbour/friend and do it on their schedule and not yours. The ability to be like "oh, I've got a spare hour here, I'm gonna go grab that lumber I need next weekend" isn't possible anymore.

So at the end of the day, you need a car, period. I live in a midsize American city after living in a major Canadian downtown and wish we didn't need the car (we both bike a lot), but I really do. And personally, an electric pick-up is gonna be mighty appealing for my next car in however-many years because it removes the main reason I've never gotten one before: gas. I can only imagine how big a win the lack of gas is gonna be outside of America where gas is hilariously cheap.

Re: 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning

#639

Post by aynyc »

aaronbeekay wrote: post #618
aynyc wrote: post #518

This is a contractor's dream truck. * Power supply. This thing supports ton of recharging of power tools. Lawn cares services will love this as more and more communities are banning gas-powdered tools. * Range. 300 is well within most contractors' home to work site. * Frunk. Lock away their valuable tools without unloading the toolbox. * Look. It's what they know and trust. It's something new yet familiar. Next step…

Ford released the e-Transit before the Lightning! https://www.ford.com/commercial-trucks/e-transit/2022/

Wow, Ford is hitting the commercial market before Tesla did!

Re: 2022 Ford F-150 Lightning

#640

Post by ummonk »

pokstad wrote: post #272
leesec wrote: post #230

I'm really happy Ford and others are starting to actually deliver on EV's. I do however think there will be a long list of issues as they scale the roll out, given the newness and complexity of this product. Here are some concerns I think people should be aware of: 1. No comprehensive supercharger network. This is a real big deal still. Using existing non-supercharging networks is not feasible for any long distance.…

Re autopilot: I want an electric truck, but there’s no way in hell I’m trusting my life to Bay Area tech. I want to save money on gas and be more eco friendly. My truck driving for me is not a want until the tech is perfected.

You shouldn't trust driver assistance features, Bay Area tech or not. They're there to assist you and decrease the burden of constant throttle / steering wheel management; you should still be constantly monitoring and ensuring the driver assistance tech is doing what it should.
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