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Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

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Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#631

Post by kortilla »

tptacek wrote: post #626
kortilla wrote: post #624

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a simple question about stats. How often does Amazon kick off services because of weak moderation and not because of illegal content? It’s not like these posts were not called out by government officials as illegal needing takedown that Parler refused to comply with. Your analogy is shitty because there was no violent revolution conducted by Parler against Amazon. The correct Analogy is the airline pilot kicking…

That analogy makes very little sense, because an airline carrying Parler employees is in no meaningful sense an operational part of Parler's business, while AWS clearly is. I think you're reaching. It doesn't much matter; this case is dead in the water.

It wasn’t my analogy to begin with. I was illustrating how stupid the analogy was to a passenger threatening the pilot. Parler didn’t threaten Amazon.

If you want to argue that travel isn’t essential to a business’s employees, that’s fine. My original question still stands though. How often does Amazon kick off tenants when they haven’t broken laws or abused technology (e.g. spammers)?

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#632

Post by kortilla »

danhor wrote: post #563
kortilla wrote: post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a scale significant enough that there are, annually, news cycles about the psychic toll Facebook moderation takes on the army of people Facebook pays to do it. Funny you should bring those news stories up, because they are often focused on how understaffed these efforts are. On a moderator to 100k user ratio, Facebook and Parler had effectively the same (0). Just because Facebook pays a few hundred people to suffer…

2.8B mau & 15000 moderators is .5 per 100k for facebook.

Right, do you realize how insufficient that is? 1 person in charge of the speech, photos, and videos of 200k people.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#633

Post by fjabre »

triceratops wrote: post #483
colinmhayes wrote: post #475

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was designed to be unfair. The small states threw a fit at the constitutional convention so now we're stuck with this bs. Why does representative democracy mean some people are more represented than others? Why can't everyone be equally represented in a representative democracy?

Right? "We are a representative democracy" is some Orwellian doublespeak. It leaves out "But some people are more represented than others."

You bring up Orwell. Both sides can get to extremism pretty easily. Both conservatives and liberals easily become dictators. Power corrupts everyone.

This has nothing to do with Orwell. Im not sure why you bring him up.

The forefathers designed the system this way. I agree with the way it was designed. It prevents big states like California and New York from calling all the shots.

I agree with the forefathers. You do not. Simple.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#634

Post by tptacek »

kortilla wrote: post #631
tptacek wrote: post #626

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That analogy makes very little sense, because an airline carrying Parler employees is in no meaningful sense an operational part of Parler's business, while AWS clearly is. I think you're reaching. It doesn't much matter; this case is dead in the water.

It wasn’t my analogy to begin with. I was illustrating how stupid the analogy was to a passenger threatening the pilot. Parler didn’t threaten Amazon. If you want to argue that travel isn’t essential to a business’s employees, that’s fine. My original question still stands though. How often does Amazon kick off tenants when they haven’t broken laws or abused technology (e.g. spammers)?

What does "abused technology" mean? The answer is that it means approximately what Amazon and its customers agree it means, as expressed in their contracts. Your personal norms about what abuse is and isn't aren't relevant, because Amazon made theirs clear in their contracts.

Technologists on message boards who are shocked and offended at Amazon's decision are generally tipping their hands that they don't ever have contracts reviewed, or really even think about them in their day-to-day work. A plain reading of Amazon's terms --- not to mention having paid attention to how cloud providers handled Gab --- made it clear that Parler's position was untenable.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#635

Post by aneemzic »

ABeeSea wrote: post #540
gbear605 wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what way is Pinterest a Twitter competitor?

Social media companies that compete for engagement (eye ball time) to sell to advertisers.

I don't buy this argument at all. That's such a broad definition. By that logic every single business that sells any type of product or service is a competitor since they all compete for consumers money.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#636

Post by jki275 »

triceratops wrote: post #481
jki275 wrote: post #477

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They already have. If the people don't want things to be that way, they can pass amendments to change it.

They can't though. The states that would lose representation have the most incentive to block amendments. Amendments aren't done by referenda.

Amendments are done by the consent of 2/3s of the states, as is spelled out in the document that governs the union of such states.

If you don't want to call that a "referenda", I think you're incorrect, but it doesn't really matter.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#637

Post by DonHopkins »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #605
user-the-name wrote: post #543

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If by "addressed" you mean "mentioned and ignored", then yes.

Here is Twitter failing to protect a sex trafficked child despite multiple written requests. Twitter just signed a very big contract with AWS. https://uncoverdc.com/2021/01/21/doe-v-twitter-twitter-fails... Come back to me when AWS drops Twitter's new contract. Then we'll talk about whether or not Twitter has any moderation. We'll discuss whether Twitter is designed specifically to facilitate child trafficking. And e…

Nobody's going to "come back to you" because you're just trolling, not arguing in good faith, so nobody takes you seriously.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#638

Post by DonHopkins »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #595
DonHopkins wrote: post #458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I saw a lot more than screenshots. I saw a violent insurrection against the US government unfold on live TV, incited by Trump himself, with the goal of overthrowing the results of a fair election, armed sedition justified by disproven lies, which was planned and promoted and published in real time on Parler. I also saw a map of the GPS data from Parler users who posted live videos and photos of themselves storming th…

Great. Now provide the same analysis for Twitter, Facebook, iMessage, etc. The livestreams I watched which were streamed from within the WhiteHouse during the event were all on Periscope (Twitter). I have no doubt that some Parler users went into the White House. I haven't seen any evidence that Parler had no moderation. I haven't seen any evidence that Parler was any different than Facebook or Twitter with regard to…

You haven't earned the right or respect for me to bother proving anything to you, since you're obviously a troll arguing in bad faith. None of your replies to anyone even bothered to address the points they raised to counter your frivolous arguments. You're as non-sensical and delusional as any of Trump's supporters. The Gish Gallop doesn't work here. Give it up, buddy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gish_gallop

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#639

Post by zaphar »

roenxi wrote: post #627
zaphar wrote: post #621

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you consider sufficient evidence here? There were multiple documented posts on Parler that have been documented running up to the events on Jan 6'th that show people organizing and preparing for it. The evidence was present before the decision by AWS. I know folks who were collecting that events weeks before the event and predicting violence based on what they were seeing. The evidence for it is only increasi…

> What do you consider sufficient evidence here? If I became convinced the expulsion had nothing to do with Jan 6 and was part of a standard process of review that AWS conducted for all their customers then that'd be sufficient. There were, generously, a few hundred people involved in the Capitol storming. It isn't obvious how organised they were organised since they lacked guns and riots sometimes start spontaneousl…

> If I became convinced the expulsion had nothing to do with Jan 6 and was part of a standard process of review that AWS conducted for all their customers then that'd be sufficient.

Whoosh. The entire point of the evidence that exists is that Jan 6'th dramatically changed the risk calculation. Without Jan 6'th I can imagine that Parler might still be online. But if you ignore Jan 6'th and it's impacts you ignore a large part of the calculation going on for a business. Jan 6'th took Parler from hypothetically risky to proven risky.

You keep attempting to dodge or downplay those events but they happened and they had a very dramatic impact on the political landscape.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#640

Post by isaacremuant »

GavinMcG wrote: post #423
isaacremuant wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If society wasn't ok they wouldn't be the most downloaded app. This is like saying that society wasn't ok with Trump when almost half voted for him. Trying to rewrite history because there's a Ideological and political control of tech companies doesn't mean you're right. The same goes for law. Just because something is legal or you don't win a case, it doesn't mean it's right or fair.

Being an especially rabid minority does not make a majority.

I never talked about majorities but I'm not surprised to see the needless adjective.

In my experience, rabid attitudes come up whenever you don't toe conventional lines regarding the good Vs the bad American parties.

You're not allowed to an opinion that's not the right one.

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