631–640 of 820 posts
"Forced Labor" is an active form of "Slavery". "Detention" is a passive form of "Slavery". So the choice at hand is Slavery vs, Slavery. A note to the pedantic among us: I did not say "Chattel Slavery", "Modern Slavery", or any other modifiers. The Cambridge English dictionary defines slavery as "The activity of legally owning other people who are forced to work for or obey you" and "The condition of being legally ow…
Why should I believe what the "Tech Transparency Project" (funded by Open Society Foundations) says over what Apple and China say? Honest question.
Well, Apple is fighting against US legislation to thwart slave labor.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2020/11/20/apple-u...
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I'm amazed the world isn't taking more action on China. Its quite sad really, 20 years ago, any one of the headlines from this year would have prompted sanctions and denunciations... I don't think so. Nothing happened with Tibet, or after the Tiananmen Square event AFAIK. 20 years ago, the people that signed all the trade deals with countries such as China claimed it would lead to improving democracy and human righ…
You mean the “People’s Republic of China”, right? The “Republic of China” is more commonly known as “Taiwan”.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
A downstream issue with importing the product of forced labor into the US is that US manufacturing markets, business (small & medium in particular), labor, & markets affected by finance are distorted. The argument that an influx of cheap foreign goods & cheap labor costs are good for the economy does not properly consider the long term & strategic costs of hollowing out large markets where the USA once lead the world…
> A downstream issue with importing the product of forced labor into the US is that US manufacturing markets, business (small & medium in particular), labor, & markets affected by finance are distorted. The argument that an influx of cheap foreign goods are good for the economy does not properly consider the long term & strategic costs of hollowing out large markets where the USA once lead the world. That's potential…
That's a powerful point! This is a big issue that will affect our lives & the lives of generations to come.
Not to mention National Security issues & living in safe/strong neighborhoods. There are many reasons to promote ethical behavior & transparency with suppliers, on par with US standards. Ensuring that suppliers are ethical also disincentives industry/labor from leaving the US, as labor & compliance costs will be equalized.
As long as companies Apple are not legally responsible for their supply chain in front of developed countries’ courts nothing will change. In Switzerland a law that would have changed this was recently rejected. Hopefully another country makes the first step.
A downstream issue with importing the product of forced labor into the US is that US manufacturing markets, business (small & medium in particular), labor, & markets affected by finance are distorted. The argument that an influx of cheap foreign goods & cheap labor costs are good for the economy does not properly consider the long term & strategic costs of hollowing out large markets where the USA once lead the world…
In the late 1800s, a number of slave families traveled down-river from Georgia after being emancipated and homesteaded in my area on the St. Johns River. As property values increased and they started being taxed more heavily on their (mostly waterfront) land, many of these families (whose patriarchs were mostly illiterate and not at all business-savvy) ended up selling to (i.e. getting taken advantage of by) housing developers, basically losing their identity and heritage.
The story isn't necessarily a direct parallel, but the pattern reminds me of the "milkshake" scene from the movie There Will Be Blood. People shouldn't have to worry about their basic livelihood and property being stripped away by anything other than perhaps a natural disaster of some kind.
As long as companies Apple are not legally responsible for their supply chain in front of developed countries’ courts nothing will change. In Switzerland a law that would have changed this was recently rejected. Hopefully another country makes the first step.
The USA still allows prison slave labor, so good luck with that. Examples: [1] Whole Foods – This organic supermarket buys artisan cheeses and fishes from companies that employ inmates. McDonald’s – Certain McDonald store items such as cutlery and containers were made in prison. Prisoners also sew their employee uniforms, and they only make a few cents an hour from it. Target – Since the early 2000s, Target has relie…
dang: All HN fonts should be mnonospaced programmer fonts. Know your audience - we're all getting older. :)
Earlier quoted context omitted.
You have an uphill battle to convince anyone being paid (any amount) for voluntary labor is akin to slave labor.
I take issue with describing it as "voluntary", when the alternative is a longer prison sentence. It is paid a pittance, and is effectively involuntary.
That's simply untrue.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
> A downstream issue with importing the product of forced labor into the US is that US manufacturing markets, business (small & medium in particular), labor, & markets affected by finance are distorted. The argument that an influx of cheap foreign goods are good for the economy does not properly consider the long term & strategic costs of hollowing out large markets where the USA once lead the world. That's potential…
> 'American workers should not have to compete with slave labor!' That's a powerful point! This is a big issue that will affect our lives & the lives of generations to come. Not to mention National Security issues & living in safe/strong neighborhoods. There are many reasons to promote ethical behavior & transparency with suppliers, on par with US standards. Ensuring that suppliers are ethical also disincentives indu…
We want lower-paying jobs to leave, to be replaced by higher paying jobs. I think the focus should be on the latter: improve people's skill and productivity, and make sure that people can make the transition from the old jobs to the new, including a proper social safety net to see them through.
Earlier quoted context omitted.
That fits the US foot as well... - Native peoples destruction (robbed of heritage) - Spying on allies (breaks international agreements) - Lobbyists and presidential pardons (massive corruption)
Two wrongs don’t make a right—hold every last one of them accountable, don’t excuse human rights abuses by anyone just because someone else has also committed abuses.
"Forced Labor" is an active form of "Slavery". "Detention" is a passive form of "Slavery". So the choice at hand is Slavery vs, Slavery. A note to the pedantic among us: I did not say "Chattel Slavery", "Modern Slavery", or any other modifiers. The Cambridge English dictionary defines slavery as "The activity of legally owning other people who are forced to work for or obey you" and "The condition of being legally ow…
The existence of prisons are not going away, but we can do away with profiteering off of prison labor easily.