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Slack’s new WYSIWYG input box is terrible

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Re: Slack’s new WYSIWYG input box is terrible

#631

Post by DagAgren »

lucideer wrote: post #624
bishalb wrote: post #608

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I understand why this change can be annoying to the tech savvy folks of hackernews, it can be quite helpful for those who aren't that tech savvy and want easy ways to bold, italicize texts (that make up majority of the slack user base). Heck I am sure most of the slack users wouldn't even know it was possible to bold, italicize on slack using markdown.

Why does anyone (tech savvy or otherwise) need to bold or italicize anything. In my mind bolding/italicizing are nice-to-haves alongside emoji. You wouldn't compromise the entire functional user experience of the central feature of your app for nicer emojis. (at least I hope not).

They compromised the part that you already said was not important, not the "entire functional user experience", though?

Re: Slack’s new WYSIWYG input box is terrible

#632

Post by marktangotango »

Sholmesy wrote: post #541
josteink wrote: post #521

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I want to immediately stop using this software but have no choice As someone who never got into slack, and never found it appealing... How so?

If it is the primary method of communicating within your team/company, then you will find it difficult to not use it, or rather you will be left out of major decisions/changes.

You’ve described the pathology and first reason to NOT use chat for anything important. What am I supposed to do? Sit on the chat all day so I don’t miss anything? I’m on a team that does this now. I ignore the 100 to 1000 plus messages and memes a day and I have missed “important decisions”. It’s a net negative imo.

Re: Slack’s new WYSIWYG input box is terrible

#633

Post by mojuba »

livueta wrote: post #50

Specific bug gripes aside: I see this editor as emblematic of Slack's broader shift away from what I think it should be (primarily synchronous chat; irc with a friendlier ui and integrated bouncer features) towards what many people seem to want to use it as (async-heavy pseudo-replacement for email where I get to sit and watch the "...is typing" indicator flicker while somebody writes an essay at me). My rule of thum…

I think they are betting on managers and in this regard it's going to work out well for them. After all Slack is a company thing (slowly turning into corporate thing) i.e. the decision to use it will likely be made by those who like WYSIWYG but hate putting stars or backticks in their messages, or don't understand the concept at all.

So, in the end it's a very clever move.

Re: Slack’s new WYSIWYG input box is terrible

#634

Post by Frondo »

lucideer wrote: post #624
bishalb wrote: post #608

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I understand why this change can be annoying to the tech savvy folks of hackernews, it can be quite helpful for those who aren't that tech savvy and want easy ways to bold, italicize texts (that make up majority of the slack user base). Heck I am sure most of the slack users wouldn't even know it was possible to bold, italicize on slack using markdown.

Why does anyone (tech savvy or otherwise) need to bold or italicize anything. In my mind bolding/italicizing are nice-to-haves alongside emoji. You wouldn't compromise the entire functional user experience of the central feature of your app for nicer emojis. (at least I hope not).

Honestly, the unsatisfying answer is simply because they (i.e. those of us who didn't grow up on IRC, like marketing teams) want to, and are used to being able to do it elsewhere. I'm sure the people who include images in email and set their own fonts and stuff are happy with the upgrade; I can especially relate to that since I used to do some marketing and sales work myself.

I also hate the new input field but I understand why they turned it on globally. But a strong enough want is often indistinguishable from a need.

Re: Slack’s new WYSIWYG input box is terrible

#636

Post by eyko »

thatguyagain wrote: post #499
greggman2 wrote: post #474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they quite likely have done lots of user testing that has shown clear desirability, improved value to user, improved usability I have never worked at a company that did user testing or if they did it was always done in a way or interpreted in a way to back up the designer's opinion. I don't think I've once in my entire 40 yr career seen a designer test with users, find out something was bad, and change their design…

I work for a relatively large global tech company (100k+ employees), and our UX teams does this all the time. First they come up with a design they _think_ will work, then do user testing, and often the user is confused or doesn't like a specific thing - could be a button color or an entire flow - and we change it. Then repeat.

I think what your UX teams are doing is (or comes across as) the opposite:

1. Come up with a design they think will work 2. Do user testing looking for confirmation that it works. 3. Change things (based on user feedback) in their design until they find confirmation.

I've come across this, and I wouldn't say it's data driven. It's, if anything, data supported, but it is still sounds like the initial design/idea still comes from within and there's a chance that it's down to their taste, interests and convictions. Or worse, a trend. We tend to pitch our ideas along with the data to support them so it's natural to seek confirmation as part of our normal workflows, but that's very different to taking design decisions based on telemetry, user feedback, etc.

Now, it's possible that I'm completely wrong and your UX teams actually does that. For instance:

1. You get support tickets from users about a missing or difficult to use feature. 2. This prompts team to design act. Design decisions are made, user testing happens, feature or changes are released. Once released, you notice from your telemetry data that the feature is rarely used by the wider audience, perhaps some of its UI items are used more than others. 3. UX team goes back to the drawing board to try to improve visibility, and does user testing.

Success rate is usually higher in that situation since you know users actually want that feature or change, and it's just about getting it right.

In Slack's case, I'm left wondering if any users actually wanted this change.

Re: Slack’s new WYSIWYG input box is terrible

#637

Post by Nextgrid »

bishalb wrote: post #608
sambe wrote: post #495

This is not one of those "oh, that's annoying, i'll have to remember that and learn to work around it" issues. It's more like "I want to immediately stop using this software but have no choice". Its driving me crazy - Slack is all text input. Don't break text input dummy!

While I understand why this change can be annoying to the tech savvy folks of hackernews, it can be quite helpful for those who aren't that tech savvy and want easy ways to bold, italicize texts (that make up majority of the slack user base). Heck I am sure most of the slack users wouldn't even know it was possible to bold, italicize on slack using markdown.

Why does everything need to cater to idiots instead of making them learn? If we continue down this trend we’ll end up with keyboards with a single button to cater to some monkeys out there who can’t manage to use a proper keyboard, at the expense of everyone else’s productivity.

Is this the future we really want?

Re: Slack’s new WYSIWYG input box is terrible

#638

Post by djsumdog »

epanchin wrote: post #577
guessmyname wrote: post #46

This is funny because I work across the street of Slack’s office in Vancouver, Canada and two Slack engineers who I frequently chat with during our daily commute already told me they —and a handful of other employees— hate the WYSIWYG input box too, but were afraid to express their feelings because their role is irrelevant compared to the people who made the decision to ship it.

Please ask them what they think of the ‘drafts’ section. I’m so fed up of losing chats to that section.

I'm surprised that hasn't been reverted yet. It's so fucking stupid. Where did that chat go? oh it's up in drafts? WTF?

Terrible UI choice. It makes no sense.

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