Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

twitter.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

621–630 of 820 posts

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#621

Post by zo1 »

watwut wrote: post #573
xp84 wrote: post #458

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't have to convince every Trump voter. The margin who swung from Biden to Trump and elected Trump aren't all those things. They just don't want what the Dems were selling in 2024, specifically: the dems' adopted ideology surrounding gender, plus using race and gender to pick who gets jobs and into schools, rather than merit. If they removed just those two planks from the DNC platform, (1) Harris would have nev…

> They just don't want what the Dems were selling in 2024, specifically: the dems' adopted ideology surrounding gender, plus using race and gender to pick who gets jobs and into schools, rather than merit. Except that, none of this is true. Democrats did not run on such policy at all. They heavily tried to appeal to center. Republicans run on culture war. And won, because it literally did not mattered what democratic…

I don't think we conceptually live in the same universe if you think those things about the democratic 2024 messaging. I just don't understand how you and your opposing commenters can have any meaningful discussion if you're so wildly differing in interpretation of such a public topic.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#622

Post by kitd »

kettlecorn wrote: post #558
xp84 wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> weaponized against us I take a more optimistic stance here. Trump can only live so long, and everybody except basically Trump and John Bolton knows that the majority of his idiotic tariffs (and nonsensical belligerence like pretending NATO control of Greenland doesn't meet all our defense needs) are wealth-destroying on net, as well as wealth-destroying for at least 10x the number of people than they help (many of…

The decades long level of trust in the US and its institutions was unprecedented and built off of the tremendous goodwill and momentum post WW2. It was an unusually high degree of trust, and now it's unusually low. Even if the US reverses its policies it will take a very long time to rebuild trust, and even then the historical warning marker of the Trump admin will be studied as a reason to never return to the prior…

My fear as a Briton and European is that even when Trump departs, the distrust remains so long as the US continues to be so politically divided. The chance of Trump being replaced by someone similar or worse will make most European politicians (incl UK ones) throw their hands up in despair.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#623

Post by holowoodman »

arjie wrote: post #535
terminalshort wrote: post #519

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Germany elected Hitler and we pretty much trusted them again in less than 20 years.

That is a sound point. I don't think your comment should be grey. In practice, I don't think geopolitics is played in the style of "Yurusenai!" that a lot of online commenters make it sound like. The world wasn't in some benevolent kumbaya between the various players involved here. America perhaps pioneered the mutual-defense agreement as an expansion of de-facto borders. America can attack you if you attack any of i…

> All this "Americans must realize you are now PARIAHS and will NEVER BE TRUSTED AGAIN" business will seem novel to people today, but this was true when I was younger and America had just invaded Iraq right after Afghanistan.

Nobody really cared about Iraq or Afghanistan. Sure, it was fashionable to pretend to care, to get on a high horse and tell the USian rabble how immoral they were. But at the same time, people on their high horses also were glad that there was no Saddam Hussein anymore and that the Taliban were beaten (seemingly, back then).

It's different now because the US threatened to invade the Kingdom of Denmark, a supposedly very close ally. Even the threat of doing that is a red line that will be very very hard to uncross after Trump.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#624

Post by nbardy »

They should probably fund their military first.

It’s petulant the way the EU is throwing a hissy fit after we’ve had lop-sided trade deals for years and funding the entire NATO alliance ourselves.

They act like we’re going to war with them when we’re asking for parity and for their self reliance to increase.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#626

Post by ndsipa_pomu »

samus wrote: post #613
jillesvangurp wrote: post #571

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With 40M people, Canada is about half the size of Germany in terms of population and GDP. Also smaller than France. Canada is more similar in GDP to countries like Italy. The Spanish economy is a bit smaller but it has slightly more people (48M). The EU + UK is a bit over half a billion people. The thing with Zoom, Meets, Teams, etc. is that these aren't that hard to replicate. There is not much of a technical moat.…

Teams has the upside that is is deeply integrated in Microsoft products.

That seems like a downside to me, but as a Linux user, I tend to shun Microsoft products.

I do have to use Teams occasionally for work and bizarrely the web client in Firefox works far better than the native Linux Teams client. Not particularly difficult as the Linux Teams client wouldn't do anything except display a blank box (this was on Ubuntu).

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#627

Post by ndsipa_pomu »

ropable wrote: post #511
xp84 wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> weaponized against us I take a more optimistic stance here. Trump can only live so long, and everybody except basically Trump and John Bolton knows that the majority of his idiotic tariffs (and nonsensical belligerence like pretending NATO control of Greenland doesn't meet all our defense needs) are wealth-destroying on net, as well as wealth-destroying for at least 10x the number of people than they help (many of…

Trump has done/is doing generational harm to the perception of the US worldwide, to say nothing of US soft-power influence. It's going to take decades to rebuild that trust after he's gone, and we still have a couple of years of his term to run yet.

Given that a sizeable percentage of U.S. people seem to still support Trump, I don't think trust is going to be rebuilt. There's also the massive issue of the U.S. political system that has been shown to have a fatal flaw - that would have to be fixed along with the broken two party system.

I liken it to Germany rebuilding trust after WWII.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#628

Post by holowoodman »

solidsnack9000 wrote: post #536
trymas wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Before: US: "please increase military spending" EU: "no" What this meant between the lines for 60+ years is “please increase military spending on US overpriced weapons that we gonna sell you, weapons will be degraded versions of native counterparts and don’t think about making your own independent military industry. Oh by the way bring those weapons when we will do 20 years of failed occupation in Middle East, beca…

It really did not mean that -- it meant to increase spending to the targets set by NATO and to meet realistic defense needs. A lot of EU weaponry was and is produced in the EU and the US has known that all along, cooperated and fostered it. The Leopard tank, the Eurofighter, the Rafale, the Lynx, the FV432, the Gazelle -- there is a long list of domestic weapons systems. I'm not sure if they still can do it, but the…

> I'm not sure if they still can do it, but the English made nuclear submarines.

Not really. The Polaris and Trident SLBM systems as well as the nukes they carry are US designs that the UK is allowed to use. And while their current PWR2 reactor is a British design, it is lacking. Therefore the next PWR3 design will be based on US S9G reactors.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#629

Post by Ravus »

kettlecorn wrote: post #558
xp84 wrote: post #388

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> weaponized against us I take a more optimistic stance here. Trump can only live so long, and everybody except basically Trump and John Bolton knows that the majority of his idiotic tariffs (and nonsensical belligerence like pretending NATO control of Greenland doesn't meet all our defense needs) are wealth-destroying on net, as well as wealth-destroying for at least 10x the number of people than they help (many of…

The decades long level of trust in the US and its institutions was unprecedented and built off of the tremendous goodwill and momentum post WW2. It was an unusually high degree of trust, and now it's unusually low. Even if the US reverses its policies it will take a very long time to rebuild trust, and even then the historical warning marker of the Trump admin will be studied as a reason to never return to the prior…

One should not overlook the human/emotional aspect. Decision-makers are not immune from it.

Hegemony comes with a certain degree of humiliation. Socially, it means accepting that a foreign language being taught in elementary schools becomes synonym with intelligence and eloquence, or protecting a copyright/taxation regime that go against your interest, or accepting that manslaughters perpetuated by troops stationed in foreign military installation on your soil will go unpunished, and so on. There's always been creeping resentment towards the US in any given European nation.

However, resentment is not a concern when "adults are in the room", even if not explicitly in charge. Economic prosperity is great, no one wants to break a good deal. But now those safeguards are failing on the US side. There's suddenly room to rationalize any hostility.

Sure, the extent to which this is a factor vs rational analysis is arguable... but I don't find it mere coincidence that France is the nation spearheading this.

Re: France Aiming to Replace Zoom, Google Meet, Microsoft Teams, etc.

#630

Post by lm28469 »

Esophagus4 wrote: post #391
lm28469 wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's only one thing they need to replace if they want to show independence: ChatGPT Before or after the bubble pops? What does chatgpt has over competitors again? Besides a deranged ceo of course

Uhhh... 800m active users?

Uhhh... barely 5% paying users?

The day they ask 1 cent from free users they'll go to the countless alternatives

Post reply on HN