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Apple picks Gemini to power Siri

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Re: Apple picks Gemini to power Siri

#621
post #276

What happens to on-device intelligence? Does it stay a massive part of the Apple Intelligence offer? Or can we expect everything to be offloaded to the cloud?

Gemini has the nano models that run on-device as well, right?

Can we switch to it, on the website, to test its capabilities?

Re: Apple picks Gemini to power Siri

#622

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you do this on a HomePod? I could definitely see Apple limiting this to newer hardware, as a way to bump sales.

Let me get back to you on this, but it'll take me a few days EDIT: Here you go, it's very barebones, but it's better than nothing (I hope): https://github.com/cockbrand/siri-gemini-shortcut As you'd expect, the code is vibed by Gemini :)

[deleted]

Re: Apple picks Gemini to power Siri

#623

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I appreciate the response, but that doesn't really answer my question. I want to know why the executive leadership at Apple failed to see LLMs as the future of AI. ChatGPT and Gemini are what Siri should be at this point. Siri was one of the leading voice-automated assistants of the past decade, and now Apple's only options are to strap on an existing solution to the name of their product or let it go defunct. So now…

According to everything that has been reported, both the Google Assistant and Alexa are less reliable now that they are LLM based. I don’t know why, in my much smaller scale experience, converting to an LLM “tools” based approached from the Intent based approach is much more reliable. Siri was behind pre LLM because Apple didn’t throw enough monkeys at the problem. Everything that an assistant can do is “hardcoded” e…

I don't really want to continue on with this discussion, as AI in general can be absolutely infuriating. It's one of those buzzwords that's just being thrown around without a care in the world at this point, but do you have any links to those reports? I'd be willing to bet that if Google Assistant and Alexa were being run properly, then they shouldn't be less reliable when working with an LLM.

I don't think Apple didn't have enough people working on Siri, I think they had too many people working on the wrong problems. If they had any eye on the industry like they did in their heyday when Jobs was at the helm they would've been all over LLMs like Sam Altman was with his OpenAI startup. This report of SIRI using Gemini going forward is one of the biggest signs that Apple is failing to innovate, let alone the constant rehashing of Iphone and IOS. They haven't been innovative in years.

And yes that's the point I was trying to make, AI assistants shouldn't be hardcoded to do certain things, that's not AI - but with Apple's marketing, they'd have you believe that SIRI is what AI should be, except now everyone's wiser, everyone and their grandmother has used ChatGPT which is really what SIRI should have been. Changes to the IOS API should roll out and an LLM backed AI assistant should be able to pick up on those changes automatically, SIRI should be an LLM trained on Apple Data, its APIS, your personal data (emails, documents,etc.), and a whole host of publicly available data. This would actually make SIRI useful going into the future.

Again, if Apple's marketing team were to be believed, SIRI would be the most advanced LLM on the planet, but from a technical standpoint, they haven't even started training an LLM at all. It's nonsense.

Re: Apple picks Gemini to power Siri

#624

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Them having bolted on ChatGPT in the ugly way they did is evidence though. Their naff image generation tool (Playground) is further evidence. Apple are definitely panicking. And they should be too.

> Them having bolted on ChatGPT in the ugly way they did is evidence though That's evidence they forced themselves. Not that there was a forcing function. That's the whole point of the top comment. (Mine.) They rushed where they didn't have to. And I still don't think they need to rush.

That’s some politician-grade logic you’ve got there:

A company can be forced into a decision because they’re scared of losing market share, but that doesn’t count as them being forced because they chose they wanted to stay in business.

The crux of the problem is that people use Gemini on Android. In fact Google have been doubling down on the AI features for years. And in a range of guise’s from camera enhancing vision models to smart personal assistants via Gemini.

Just as Apple heavily promoted Siri back when it was pioneering.

But Siri has stagnated for years. It’s basically the Internet Explorer 5 of the assistant domain. And the competition is so far ahead in capabilities that people are going to start questioning the innovation happening at Apple. In fact people already are.

I wouldn’t be surprised if the Liquid Glass misfire was a desperate attempt to make their technology feel futuristic again.

The fact is, Siri sucks. I almost never use it now. Apple knows this. We know it. Consumers know it. Apple know that they have to urgently fix it.

Re: Apple picks Gemini to power Siri

#625

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to everything that has been reported, both the Google Assistant and Alexa are less reliable now that they are LLM based. I don’t know why, in my much smaller scale experience, converting to an LLM “tools” based approached from the Intent based approach is much more reliable. Siri was behind pre LLM because Apple didn’t throw enough monkeys at the problem. Everything that an assistant can do is “hardcoded” e…

I don't really want to continue on with this discussion, as AI in general can be absolutely infuriating. It's one of those buzzwords that's just being thrown around without a care in the world at this point, but do you have any links to those reports? I'd be willing to bet that if Google Assistant and Alexa were being run properly, then they shouldn't be less reliable when working with an LLM. I don't think Apple did…

AI assistants can’t magically “do stuff” without “tools” exposed. A tool is always an API that someone has to write an expose to the orchestrator whether it’s AI or just a dumb intent system.

And ChatGPT can’t really “do anything” without access to tools.

You don’t want an LLM to have access to your total system without deterministic guardrails and limiting the permissions of what the tools can do just like you wouldn’t expose your entire database with admin privileges to the web.

You also don’t want to expose too many tools to the system. Every tool you expose you also have to have a description of what the tool does, the parameters it needs etc. Ot will both blow up your context window and start hallucinating. I suspect that’s why Alexa and Google Assistant got worse when they became LLM based and my narrow use cases don’t suffer those problems when I started implementing LLM based solutions.

And I am purposefully yada yada yadaing some of the technical complexities and I hate the entire “appeal to authority” thing. But I worked at AWS for 3.5 years until 2 years ago and I was at one point the second highest contributor to a popular open source “AWS Solution” that almost everyone in the niche had heard of dealing with voice automation. I really do know about this space.

Re: Apple picks Gemini to power Siri

#627

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.apple.com/au/legal/privacy/data/en/apple-adverti...

This very page explains that they use "local, on-device processing" and a "random identifier not tied to your Apple Account." So while the letter of your claim is technically true, it's also very misleading.

No, its not misleading it says right there in the private policy.

Apple isnt suddenly private just because they have enough data about you that they dont need to link to 3rd party data. They do exactly what 3rd party sites that are considered privacy invasive do. They serve you ads based on your private data like what you watch, what you read and what things you do on your device.

It doesnt say that they only store all this information on device. Apple is only using a random identifier when its sharing information about your habits and personal data on its ad platform, that info btw is shared with 3rd parties. But dont worry that data suddenly becomes non personal because they used a random identifier.

Re: Apple picks Gemini to power Siri

#628

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple is always behind on industry trends, but when they adopt them eventually, they become mainstream and cool. This is what will happen with the folding phones this year, if rumors are true.

> Apple is always behind on industry trends Huh, I always thought it was the other way around (whether people liked it or not): ditching floppy disks, ditching cdroms, prioritizing BT over wired earphones, etc. I am glad, though, that they were forced to stick with USB-C if I'm not mistaken.

This is very much what apple wants you to believe; they have very good PR.

In actual fact, though, apple is a very effective fifth or sixth mover, and has been for a very long time. They watch everyone else fuck it up and get it wrong a bunch of times, and then throw scads of cash at threading the needle.

Re: Apple picks Gemini to power Siri

#629

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd rather say IBM got cannibalized by "financial engineers", this wasn't a decision made because of "it's a commodity". There used to be a time when IBM actually meant quality (that's where "no one ever got fired for buying IBM" came from, after all), but nowadays? A loooot of stuff is either sold (Thinkpad went to Lenovo, Lotus Notes to HCL), faded into irrelevancy outside of extremely few niche markets (anything m…

The no one ever got fired for buying IBM wasn’t about quality. It’s always safe to buy the default choice that everyone else uses. Especially when things go wrong. Many want to be founders here on HN don’t get that. Even if your product is better and cheaper, there is too much of a reputational risk signing a contract for a B2B SaaS product with an unknown vendor. On a completely unrelated note, for the love of all t…

I imagine a lot of people on this thread see 5% Mac usage as the norm but it's really not the norm overall.
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