Why Canada Should Join the EU • Hacker News Board

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#621

Post by deanCommie » Sat, Jan 04, 2025, 6:41 AM UTC

wenc wrote: post #463

llm_nerd wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FWIW Canada does have a comprehensive free trade agreement with the EU: CETA.

I remember when CETA was ratified, and there was talk about labor mobility which got me excited. Having more options on which countries to work is always better than fewer, but I ended up in the U.S. and turns out that worked out much better for me. Others may have different views. I was once young and had romantic notions of living in Europe, but I realized that I cultivated those notions as a student, tourist and u…

I'm a Canadian who lived in Luxembourg for 4 years and agree with 100% of what you said.

I find the US too extreme in one direction and Europe too much in the other.

Canada has many problems (from both places) but by and large IMO strikes the balance reasonably well between dynamism and safety net.

It could be a lot better.

It could be a lot worse.

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#622

Post by cmrdporcupine » Sat, Jan 04, 2025, 6:42 AM UTC

tharkun__ wrote: post #422

jmb99 wrote: post #401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quote from a Chinese friend of mine form over the holidays (currently in Canada on a work visa, applying for a PR shortly, started as an exchange student in highschool): “I really like coming back to [jmb99’s hometown], it’s all white people. Nice change from Toronto.” Definitely a common sentiment.

I hadn't been to Toronto in years until recently. We went to some parks (i.e. Parks Canada / Provincial Parks) around. Little did I know that you now have to register online to book your visit. You used to just go and pay cash at the entrance and that's it. This time you had to have an account and prove identity by logging in through your bank account for example, before they'd even let you purchase said ticket. We d…

All the registration stuff around parks and conservation areas is a product of COVID, when these places were overflowing and needed reservation systems all the sudden.

Many organizations simply refuse to give up the "convenience" of having people booked in like that. Also the numbers have continued to be hard for these places to manage.

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#623

Post by wavemode » Sat, Jan 04, 2025, 6:43 AM UTC

twobitshifter wrote: post #548

gmueckl wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rejection was expected. The EU and its associated organizations are only open to countries on the European continent by their current rules. Canada would have to broker a hell of a deal to get even partially in. EFTA membership might be a possible goal.

Canada is still under the British Monarch, Charles as King of Canada. Not saying that would work but it might be one avenue. It’s also good reason that Canada joining the US would be very hard as things stand.

> Canada is still under the British Monarch

This fact probably counts -against- the argument that they deserve to be in the EU...

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#624

Post by int_19h » Sat, Jan 04, 2025, 6:45 AM UTC

TMWNN wrote: post #511

amatecha wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every major US tech company has Canada-based hubs for sure. So much cheaper.

My understanding is that Canadian FAANG offices are staffed mostly with those who cannot (and often will never get) a US visa, plus the odd local who doesn't want to move to the US for personal or family reasons.

Don't forget about all the people waiting for their L-1.

(I've been in that boat myself, and every single person I worked with in the office in Canada is in US today.)

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#625

Post by int_19h » Sat, Jan 04, 2025, 6:51 AM UTC

cmrdporcupine wrote: post #194

llm_nerd wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is absolutely, unequivocally factually correct. Canada is under population-trap growth levels, growing by over 3.2% in a single year. That is absolutely bonkers growth. Canada had more growth in absolute numbers than the US, a country almost 10x the population (and thus ability to absorb). Canada's housing is completely disconnected from reality and has a wide range of reasons, but right now we have a housing cris…

Canada does not have an illegal immigration problem, which is what is implied by the phrase migrant especially in the context of US politics and what American observers of this thread would think of as "migrant" Canada has a massive program of legal immigration, and if you'll note above I did say it plays a part in housing price inflation here, which is bonkers. In particular our legal immigration program targets alm…

> which is what is implied by the phrase migrant especially in the context of US politics and what American observers of this thread would think of as "migrant"

This isn't really the case, and especially not so in the Trump era.

If anything I'd say it's the reverse - i.e. voters and even more so politicians specifically talk about "illegal immigration" with an emphasis on "illegal", but once you start digging into it, it becomes clear that they really have a problem with immigration in general.

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#626

Post by mmooss » Sat, Jan 04, 2025, 7:02 AM UTC

int_19h wrote: post #619

mmooss wrote: post #561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Know what doesn't change very quickly? Policy and law at the municipal level. Know what changes quickly because it's done at the very top level? Immigration rate. In my experience, local policy and law changes much faster than federal, especially with GOP opposing everything on the federal level. The GOP shot down the immigration deal they negotiated last summer. Locally is where I see solutions happen (and then st…

We're talking about Canada, not US. But also, for all practical purposes, the migration rate to all rich Western countries is limited only by their respective laws and regulations governing immigration. For all of them, there are more people who want to get in than the quota allows (whether explicit or implicit via point systems etc). Any country that would fully open its borders would see millions coming in from Asi…

> the migration rate to all rich Western countries is limited only by their respective laws and regulations governing immigration.

If those laws and regulations were that powerful, the US and Europe wouldn't have so many illegal migration problems.

> People generally want to move where the life is better when they can.

I wouldn't say 'generally'. The vast majority of people want to stay where they are.

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#627

Post by remarkEon » Sat, Jan 04, 2025, 7:05 AM UTC

rayiner wrote: post #578

zeckalpha wrote: post #527

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This could be seen as a EU-nationalist framing. Just like the United States has shifted from being a federation of states toward being a singular entity.

You need a common culture to govern a country, and that culture needs to be deeper than watching the same movies and consuming the same flow of cheap Chinese products. If you don’t have a common culture, you need real federalism so people can self-segregate into more homogenous cultural groups and efficiently govern themselves. The U.S. suffers greatly from the demise of federalism and it’s insane that anybody would…

>You need a common culture to govern a country

Or, an Empire.

The EU is decidedly not that, however. Perhaps this article was published 10-20 years too soon, and one day in the future an Imperial American (or French) bureaucracy decides that it's time to bring the friends across the pond closer into the orbit of the Imperial State.

Joking, of course. The problems within the United States today (where I am made to care about the goings on in States not my own) are of course the same problems this hypothetical Empire would face.

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#628

Post by tsimionescu » Sat, Jan 04, 2025, 7:06 AM UTC

KPGv2 wrote: post #574

genman wrote: post #534

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nothing like that is even by slightest similar to indigenous people of Canada. Nothing. Also while Canada my want people, so does EU.

The English colonized, ruled, and conducted a deliberate genocide against the Irish people. It's pretty analogous. The English starved them to death. The English forcibly displaced them. The English stole their resources. The English even forbade them from speaking their language.

And about 100 years ago, the Irish rebelled and won their independence from England. And those that didn't are no longer being treated this way, and haven't been for more than 50 years.

So what exactly should the English learn from Canadians today? Even the Irish in Northern Ireland have more freedom and autonomy than the First Nations have in Canada, not less.

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#629

Post by remarkEon » Sat, Jan 04, 2025, 7:08 AM UTC

mensetmanusman wrote: post #592

bawolff wrote: post #456

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Umm no? There is (sadly) a significant anti-immigration backlash right now in canada. Its a core election issue and one of the main reasons trudeau is likely going to lose the next election.

It is sad because the government knew and failed to act on 5x-ing the rate of housing production to keep up with new arrivals. Failing to do so has screwed over so many people due to housing costs that went up due to mass migration. This was all predicted though if that makes anyone feel better.

Housing isn't the only thing that "solves" immigration issues. The immigrants have to, you know, assimilate.

For whatever reason this step has been deleted from the usual policy matrix, and as a result we've been running a great experiment over the last 20+ years in Canada, Europe, and the US.

Re: Why Canada Should Join the EU

#630

Post by whatevertrevor » Sat, Jan 04, 2025, 7:12 AM UTC

screye wrote: post #347

youngNed wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tell me more about this Indian 'subgroup', this 'low-skill-low-virtue underclass' that's built into your very fabric of society, ingrained in religion, that you don't like.

I think you're extrapolating further than I intended. I used the phrases 'low-skill-low-virtue underclass', 'slice' &'subgroup' for reasons of being precise, not as dog-whistles. 'Subgroup and slice' because Canada definitely imports some elite human capital from India. Those numbers haven't changed over the last decade. It's the 2nd type of immigration that's exploded and is worth talking about. As for your implicat…

If you have references or sources I'd love to go through them.

I'm an Indian who has lived in Canada for a decade now, and I haven't seen or heard much about Indian immigration specifically for joining gangs or anything like that.

If anything there's more evidence that Canada's immigration crisis is a result of ridiculous barriers for high skilled workers if they don't have a degree from a North American university. Countless tales of medical professionals having to redo certifications because Canada doesn't accept their pre-existing education.