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Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

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Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#621

Post by cbsmith »

bonestamp2 wrote: post #599
cbsmith wrote: post #426

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I misunderstood what you wrote. There are plenty of scalpers who sell tickets outside of TicketMaster, despite their best efforts. Do you think the $50/ticket fee that you paid would have been lower if you'd done your transaction outside of TicketMaster's platform?

I have purchased secondary tickets outside of TicketMaster many times and the fee has always been lower. But, that's anecdotal of course... there's no reason why they couldn't be higher. But, let's leave the actual fee amount aside for a moment... I'm slightly less concerned with the actual amount of the fee and more concerned with the fact that ticket scalping has apparently become legal and that the original ticket…

> It's disturbing that it's illegal to scalp a single ticket in person outside an event, but if someone does it online with hundreds of tickets then they're a "ticket broker" and that's legal (in California at least).

Legal space around ticketing is... insane. The laws protecting "ticker brokers" are cloaked as consumer friendly regulations, and ironically TicketMaster actively lobbies against online "ticket brokers".

> I have purchased secondary tickets outside of TicketMaster many times and the fee has always been lower. But, that's anecdotal of course... there's no reason why they couldn't be higher.

In general, TM's share of resell is much smaller, and the resell market is heavily fee sensitive, as the brokers like to keep as much of the money as they can, so the fees tend to be set by the market (and they didn't go up when TM got in to the business).

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#622

Post by mixmastamyk »

jmholla wrote: post #339
mlyle wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is scalping. Unfortunately, this "solution" is Ticketmaster cementing their control of the ticket marketplace and spying on their users.

And (and I think you were implying this), Ticketmaster giving themselves complete control over the still existing scalping market which they use to boost their own profits without any benefits over the standard scalping market (arguably also including further downsides).

Yup, they finally outscalped the scalpers. What a windfall the covid push to ban cash and digitize tickets was for them.

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#623

Post by mechanicalpulse »

Great read, though I am compelled to comment on this ad-hoc date/time conversion:

    $ date=$(python3 -c 'import datetime; print(datetime.datetime.fromtimestamp(1707074879).isoformat())')
Consider reaching for `date` from GNU coreutils instead:

    $ date -Is -d @1707074879
Fewer keystrokes, faster execution, and the output includes the TZ offset.

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#624

Post by mixmastamyk »

GuB-42 wrote: post #298

Does anyone knows how Ticketmaster works, really? I have been to Ticketmaster events that use reasonably priced, printable tickets, you could even buy a printed ticket with cash. In fact, even though there are so many Ticketmaster events, they are not all working the same way. And Ticketmaster doesn't have the monopoly on shitty practices, the article gives a good example in the beginning. What I suspect is that Tick…

Tours have some choices, yes. See the Cure tour last year. But no, paper tickets and non-auction prices (for front section) have been phased out quickly.

Some tiny stragglers perhaps. Went to a tiny venue recently but was goldenvoice.

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#625

Post by mixmastamyk »

futevolei wrote: post #420
benced wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think this is accurate. Ticketmaster/LiveNation control most good/big venues so artists have to deal with them in some way. Artists generally don't want to charge market clearing prices to their fans (for niceness and PR reasons) but Ticketmaster is happy to be the bad guy and do that via exorbitant fees. I'm very in favor of breaking up Ticketmaster but we should be clear-eyed about what that will do: it wil…

There was an article in the LATimes article a few years ago with the former ceo of Ticketmaster who explicitly confirmed the above. Ticketmaster does a deal with the band to charge as much as possible and take all the negative blowback or whatever about it and then gives them a kickback.

Fees split into thirds, (TM, performer, venue) is my recollection.

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#626

Post by NavinF »

sbarre wrote: post #555
NavinF wrote: post #496

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I'm asserting that the app acquires as much data as the website (ie. whatever you typed into their forms) and it gets leaked all the same. Refusing to install the app makes no sense if you still use the website

An app absolutely can track more data than a website. You don't have the website open/active on your phone at all times, but you have the app installed at all times, even when it's not running. You do know that apps can record data in the background, right? A website is also sandboxed by your browser in a much stricter manner than an app is on your phone, at least by default. I don't have specific information on the…

I'm an app dev. What can I record in the background? What can I track?

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#627

Post by NavinF »

immibis wrote: post #537
NavinF wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm an app dev. How exactly would I track your location without your consent?

For example, based on my IP address, nearby wifi networks, and camera footage.

Web apps also get your IP. Why aren't you using a VPN if you care about that?

Web apps can also get the rest if you click accept when it asks for camera access. What exactly do you lose by installing an app?

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#628

Post by 93po »

CYR1X wrote: post #112
lakerz16 wrote: post #94

I hate TM and ridiculous fees as much as anyone, but this article is overly hyperbolic. There's a section named "Pirating Tickets", that just explains how to re-create a barcode that you already paid for. You're not using this to rob anyone of anything. And at the end, "Have fun refactoring your ticket verification system". Why? There are no vulnerabilities here. A rotating barcode (even if following a known pattern)…

It's piracy in a way that's analogous to ripping like Netflix content. You are breaking away from DRM which is piracy. They also cite the potential to have multiple tokens valid per one ticket which would let multiple people get in with the same ticket.

It would be DRM if the barcode was copyrighted material, which it isn't.

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#629

Post by digging »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #615
digging wrote: post #593

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I honestly don't know how to respond to this, it's too vague.

I can try to word it better? You said when people look at moral situations, they use their own values to round their measurement. And I thought that was a good way to describe things. Then for some reason you acted like "rounding" turns things into strawman-level black and white. The slightest blemish (not hiring a specific good person) qualifying as evil. Let's say a scale of 0 to 10. If people disagree whether some…

Appreciate the explanation.

> Then for some reason you acted like "rounding" turns things into strawman-level black and white. The slightest blemish (not hiring a specific good person) qualifying as evil.

This was in direct response to the top-level comment making that very assertion (via a blog post). If I'm understanding you correctly, I think we're actually agreeing that it's absurd. The CEO of a "good" company indirectly, but unambiguously, called me a bad person for not leaving my job. I say, if it's so cut-and-dry, and I want to be a "good" person, why aren't they helping me get a better job? Of course, it's an absurd ask.

Somebody isn't only allowed to be "good" if they do every good thing possible to them. And I am sure said CEO does many acts others would consider "bad", such as eating industrial meat or flying, both of which participate in the generation of immeasurable harm.

---

Also, with regard to your scale - you've given the question too much credit. The question doesn't ask "how much are you good or bad?", it asks and receives a binary answer. And the vast, vast majority of people can't be assigned one of those binary categories of "good" and "bad".

Re: Reverse engineering Ticketmaster's rotating barcodes

#630

Post by mattmaroon »

silexia wrote: post #557
ikesau wrote: post #14

Really good post! I also found this quote which distilled their position in the 404media coverage of the situation. > “What I can say for sure is that TicketMaster and AXS have had every opportunity to support scam-free third party ticket resale and delivery platforms if they wished: By documenting their ticket QR code cryptography, and by exposing apps and APIs which would allow verification and rotation of ticket s…

Monopoly is the keyword here. Ticketmaster and Boeing and all the other nefarious companies here use PATENTS to prevent competitors from eating their lunch. Patents need to be done away with to allow free competition, don't believe the propaganda about patents helping creators

I love it when a system has been working for hundreds of years through by far the most prosperous time in human history but people on the internet are sure it is wrong. No proof, no evidence, not even logic, just certainty.

Also, I don’t think any of the issues with Ticketmaster have anything to do with patents.

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