Google is already pushing WEI into Chromium

Post by TremendousJudge » Wed, Jul 26, 2023, 5:28 PM UTC

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #400

encody wrote: post #186

It's small, but here's a real actionable item that you can do to help: Put a gentle "Use Firefox" (or any other non-Chromium-based browser) message on your website. It doesn't have to be in-your-face, just something small. I've taken my own advice and added it to my own website: https://geeklaunch.io/ (It only appears on Chromium-based browsers.) We can slowly turn the tide, little by little.

The issue with that is that most people here will only have their own website or product, which is already aimed at more tech-savvy people, who will already have made a conscious decision to use Firefox, Chrome, or whichever browser they prefer. But we / this site only represents a small percentage. 85% market share means there are hundreds of millions, if not billions of users that would have to switch to make any k…

Post by minsc_and_boo » Wed, Jul 26, 2023, 5:28 PM UTC

mplewis wrote: post #191

anshumankmr wrote: post #160

As someone who is a somewhat new to web technologies, can someone really explain why this is bad? I saw the techical discussions in the PRs made to the WEI repo but it was all super technical that I was not able to understand the arguments made for and against it.

WEI turns non-compliant browsers into second-class citizens. You’re perfectly free to use whatever compliant browser engine and OS combo you like today – but in a world with WEI, you’ll have to use Approved Chrome on an Approved OS on Approved Hardware with Approved Signing Keys, or you won’t be able to sign into your bank.

Post by kykeonaut » Wed, Jul 26, 2023, 5:30 PM UTC

izacus wrote: post #419

tolmasky wrote: post #197

Mozilla should call for Google's removal from the W3C over this implementation of Web Environment Integrity. "But Chrome has 65% market share, what good is the W3C without them?” If Google can take unilateral action to fundamentally change the basic principles of the web, then the W3C is already useless. This will give Google a clear choice: if they want to maintain the idea that the W3C matters, they should withdraw…

It didn't happen when Apple did it with Safari (and you all were quiet as a mouse as well, with HN actively defending Apple Safari monopoly with this feature enabled)... so why would NOW be any different?

Post by 4oo4 » Wed, Jul 26, 2023, 5:32 PM UTC

hooverd wrote: post #604

4oo4 wrote: post #576

Don't just comment and complain, contact your antitrust authority today: US: - https://www.ftc.gov/enforcement/report-antitrust-violation - antitrust@ftc.gov EU: - https://competition-policy.ec.europa.eu/antitrust/contact_en - comp-greffe-antitrust@ec.europa.eu UK: - https://www.gov.uk/guidance/tell-the-cma-about-a-competition... - general.enquiries@cma.gov.uk India: - https://www.cci.gov.in/antitrust/ - https://www.…

A customizable form letter would be nice to have, if anyone wants to jump on that. I'm not a great writer in that respect.

    I would like to bring your attention to Google’s recent proposal to add a feature to its Chrome (Chromium family) of browsers called Web Environment Integrity. This provides a mechanism to reinforce Google’s already dominant browser market position by creating a technological control that can be used to nullify a user’s choice of browser, device and operating system. This technology also has the potential for abuse by preventing users from using browser extensions that can enhance security by blocking unwanted and potentially malicious content, as well as browser extensions that help vulnerable users with enhanced accessibility needs, such as color blindness and visual impairment.

    Google’s dominant, near-monopoly position in the browser market already harms me as a consumer by reducing browser choices and preventing a competitive market for developing new browsers. Allowing Google to include this feature will reduce my browser choices and consolidate the browser market even further, and it is incumbent on [INSERT AUTHORITY HERE] to take action against this abusive behavior.

Post by hot_gril » Wed, Jul 26, 2023, 5:32 PM UTC

_fat_santa wrote: post #61

Not a lawyer but this seems ripe for antitrust action. Microsoft got sued back in the 2000's for simply bundling IE with their operating system. The behavior of Google (and quite frankly Microsoft with Edge) seems way way worse than whatever MS was doing when they got sued.