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Tesla recalls 360k vehicles, says full self-driving beta may cause crashes

cnbc.com

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Re: Tesla recalls 360k vehicles, says full self-driving beta may cause crashes

#621

Post by justapassenger »

93po wrote: post #589
justapassenger wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And how does that change anything about my statements? Yeah, they have QA. But for the problem they claim they’re solving (robotaxis) and speed of pushing stuff to customers (on the order of days) it vastly, vastly insufficient. And it lacks any safety lifecycle process regards - again, just look at the timelines. Even if you’re super efficient, you cannot possibly claim you can even such a basic things like proper c…

> it lacks any safety lifecycle process completely demonstrably false > speed of pushing stuff to customers (on the order of days) this is also false and doesn't happen > you cannot possibly claim you can even such a basic things like proper change management (no, commit message isn’t that) or validation. you know absolutely nothing about the internal timelines of developments and deployments at tesla and to suggest…

> > it lacks any safety lifecycle process > completely demonstrably false

Head of AP, testified under oath, that they don't know what's Operational Design Domain. I'll just leave it at that.

> > speed of pushing stuff to customers (on the order of days) > this is also false and doesn't happen

Never ever Musk tweeted about .1 fixing some critical issues coming in next few days? I must live in a different timeline.

> > you cannot possibly claim you can even such a basic things like proper change management (no, commit message isn’t that) or validation. > you know absolutely nothing about the internal timelines of developments and deployments at tesla and to suggest it's impossible without that knowledge is just dishonest

Let's assume I have no internal information. If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck.

Re: Tesla recalls 360k vehicles, says full self-driving beta may cause crashes

#622

Post by oblib »

Splitting hairs on the definition of "recall" of a potential deadly flaw in 362,758 automobiles is silly. But is is the correct word for that industry when there is one.

I worked at a Oldsmobile dealer in the 80s and fixed all kinds of issues on cars that were "recalled" and that is what we called it way back then and long before it. Some were trivial and others were serious safety issues.

https://www.kbb.com/car-advice/what-do-i-need-to-know-about-...

Re: Tesla recalls 360k vehicles, says full self-driving beta may cause crashes

#623

Post by DesiLurker »

idlewords wrote: post #141

I love that this is the same guy who wants to send people to Mars one-way and then figure out the return trip later.

yeah wonder how will the OTA updates work for MARS spacecrafts, 'cause there is no air in between. Checkmate Musk!

Re: Tesla recalls 360k vehicles, says full self-driving beta may cause crashes

#624

Post by super_flanker »

JoshCole wrote: post #411
panick21_ wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have actual knowlage of Tesla internal QA processes, any kind of source at all? Based on there presentation, they for sure have a whole load of tests, many built directly from real world situation that the car has to handle. They simulate sensor input based on the simulation and check the car does the right thing. They very likely have some internal test drivers and before the software goes public it goes to t…

I strongly feel people ought to have these discussions while consistently citing actual data sources relevant to the discussion. For example, did you predict, based on the speculation of Tesla being incompetent with regard to safety, that they have the lowest probability of injury scores of any car manufacturer? Because they do. Did you predict, based on speculation about Elon Musk's incompetence in predicting that s…

This report is for Autopilot, not FSD which everyone else is talking about on HN.

Re: Tesla recalls 360k vehicles, says full self-driving beta may cause crashes

#625

Post by dzhiurgis »

panick21_ wrote: post #410

I wish all the ink spilled on controversy over Tesla would instead be spilled on doing basic safety improvement to the road system that are cheap and proven to save many lives. Lets be real here, automated driving or not, having actually save roads helps prevent death and harm in many cases. The hyper focus on high tech software by all the agencies engaged in 'automotive security' is totally wrongly focused. What the…

I spent 6 months driving a 2019 Hyundai with lane assist and radar cruise control. Personally it's almost perfect. If you added some smart road features - to improve lane assist and better sign readability (to drop the speed as I enter town or curve and increase when I leave one). I don't need full self driving, just an improvement on speed control and some lane assist.

Would smart roads be expensive? RFID responders seem super cheap compared to how much actual asphalt costs. Authorities are currently unable to remotely control flows, speeds and safety which is completely bonkers.

Re: Tesla recalls 360k vehicles, says full self-driving beta may cause crashes

#626

Post by tshaddox »

now__what wrote: post #507
diebeforei485 wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Recall implies something being returned. This should be called a mandatory software patch, or something like that. The problem is Tesla owners repeatedly see "recall" to mean "software update", so this might lead to a lot of confusion if a physical recall is actually required in the future.

In auto recalls, "recall" more generally implies something being repaired than returned, IME

Yeah, but the reason why they used the word "recall" is that "recall" was already a word that means to officially demand that something (or someone) be returned to a previous location. Of course, before over the air software updates, essentially anything on an automobile that needed to be replaced/repaired/modified would need to be returned to a dealer/mechanic to do so. So now it sounds a little weird to some people to refer to an over the air software update as a recall.

Re: Tesla recalls 360k vehicles, says full self-driving beta may cause crashes

#627

Post by super_flanker »

jjcon wrote: post #476
2h wrote: post #434

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. If someone is a bad driver, and causing crashes, we don't say "we need to improve the road system". We suspend the drivers license until they can prove they are capable of being a safe driver. We should hold this software to the same standard. Until it can demonstrate safety at or above human level, it should be outlawed. Road systems should always be worked on, but when a crash happens its usually the dr…

Tesla publishes their safety data quarterly no need for your many assumptions and speculations - Teslas are already much safer than the average driver, especially when autopilot is on https://www.tesla.com/VehicleSafetyReport

Autopilot is not FSD, this report is clearly about Autopilot, they haven't mentioned anything about FSD in it.

Re: Tesla recalls 360k vehicles, says full self-driving beta may cause crashes

#630

Post by 1970-01-01 »

oblib wrote: post #622

Splitting hairs on the definition of "recall" of a potential deadly flaw in 362,758 automobiles is silly. But is is the correct word for that industry when there is one. I worked at a Oldsmobile dealer in the 80s and fixed all kinds of issues on cars that were "recalled" and that is what we called it way back then and long before it. Some were trivial and others were serious safety issues. https://www.kbb.com/car-adv…

The news headlines coming out are also interesting. 'Tesla Recalls' vs 'Tesla Voluntary Recalls' are technically both true, however the former is a much more popular headline while being less precise.
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