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Pfizer and Biontech provide update on Omicron variant

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Re: Pfizer and Biontech provide update on Omicron variant

#621

Post by dang »

swayvil wrote: post #351
jmnicolas wrote: post #334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Expert on tv explained it just yesterday.. 3 shots is actually what you need for most vaccines and is the common procedure for most if you remember.. The same so called experts that will say that now you need the 4th dose, the 5th etc. It's now obvious that it's a vaccine as a service. Pfizer ceo's hinted at it last year, saying it would probably be recurring every 6 months.

Checking out your replies that got flagged and killed. Mob style censorship is alive and well here.

Would you please stop posting flamewar comments to HN? You've been doing it a lot and we ban that sort of account, regardless of what you're flaming for or against. This isn't a site for ideological battle or wake-up-sheeple rants.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Pfizer and Biontech provide update on Omicron variant

#622

Post by dang »

robotmay wrote: post #438
jmnicolas wrote: post #364

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a lost battle, the majority on HN decided to suspend doubt about the vaccines and the crooks at Pfizer (look at their judiciary past, the name crook is warranted). It's funny how smart people can read regularly articles that show that 90% of scientific papers aren't reproducible (so it's actually not science) then will proceed to trust blindly the next scientific paper they read.

It's not censorship if people just think you're fucking idiots.

Attacking another user like this is not ok here, regardless of how wrong they are or you feel they are.

If you'd please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to the rules when posting here, we'd appreciate it.

Re: Pfizer and Biontech provide update on Omicron variant

#623

Post by choward »

ohyes wrote: post #549
artificialLimbs wrote: post #500

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because this: https://www.forbes.com/sites/adamandrzejewski/2021/11/04/fed... despite this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lepqvdXoA2E&feature=youtu.be Oops, you can't watch that. Senators holding an expert panel is "dangerous misinformation". Here you go: https://rumble.com/vokrf7-sen.-johnson-expert-panel-on-feder...

Just so it is clear to you, the Forbes article you link is an opinion piece.

Just so it's clear to you, there are facts in opinion piece. Opinion pieces are often someone's opinion on existing facts.

Re: Pfizer and Biontech provide update on Omicron variant

#624

Post by microtherion »

hcknwscommenter wrote: post #595
timr wrote: post #580

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Israeli study highlighted previous infection versus vaccinated Yes, they did this, and showed that natural infection was superior to vaccination alone. > but not (yet) infected. Incorrect. > Note the "previously infected" category did not exclude the vaccinated, but the vaccinated category did exclude the previously infected. No. You only have to read the link to see that your understanding of the study is enti…

Okay. I admit that my characterization was sloppy/incorrect. Thank you for pointing that out. The paper is still not strong evidence though. To whit: "the higher hospitalization rate in the 32,000-person analysis was based on just eight hospitalizations in a vaccinated group and one in a previously infected group. And the 13-fold increased risk of infection in the same analysis was based on just 238 infections in the…

Even if the numbers scale up, they'd mean that you'd avoid roughly 1 hospitalization for every 2285 people who got immunity from being infected instead of from being vaccinated. Unfortunately, to obtain that immunity, about 1 in 30 had to be hospitalized, 1 in 250 died, and a significant number suffered serious complications.

Nobody in their right mind would choose such a tradeoff.

Re: Pfizer and Biontech provide update on Omicron variant

#625

Post by dang »

_Understated_ wrote: post #92
glial wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You gave an inflammatory conclusion "we're all being lied to!" without showing how you reached that conclusion.

Perhaps I flew off the handle. Partly due to being flagged with no reply!

The other relevant factor is that if you lead with "Ok, I'm going to get flamed, downvoted or whatever for this", people will downvote/flag the post almost regardless of what it says, because (a) it's against the site guidelines, (b) it's a tedious internet trope, and (c) it's reliably a marker of bad comments. Best to edit that kind of thing out in the future.

Re: Pfizer and Biontech provide update on Omicron variant

#626

Post by toyg »

hcurtiss wrote: post #538
toyg wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or rather if those 3 days turned into death. I'd rather take boosters every year than risk a horrible death.

No matter how small the risk?

At "peak times", it isn't that small - even in my ridiculously small social circle, in Italy, there was one death and a couple of very severe cases. And peak times are determined largely by the pressure on health services, which is determined by vaccination rates (since vaccines remove the need for hospitalization). So it's a vicious circle: if you don't vaccinate, you increase the mortality risk to very significant levels.

Re: Pfizer and Biontech provide update on Omicron variant

#627

Post by angelzen »

hcknwscommenter wrote: post #531
listless wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This has always been my fear. I'm vaccinated (Moderna) and got COVID in September. I recovered quickly - about 3 days. But I'm worried that my body did not get to have a proper immune response and that as such, I'll have to continue get vaccinated forever whereas if I had just gotten COVID without the vaccine maybe I would be set. But I haven't found _much_ data to back up this concern.

Long-lasting original antigenic sin (e.g., an immune system trapped for years (or forever) in a sub-optimal state by a vaccination event) is a very unlikely scenario. I don't think we have ever seen something like that for any other virus? So, it's no surprise you haven't found much data. I would also suggest you critically examine whatever data you have found that supposedly backs up this concern of yours.

Long-lasting original antigenic sin is well documented at least for dengue.

"Original antigenic sin has the advantage that a response can be rapidly mobilized from memory. However, the downside is that in some cases, such as dengue, the response is dominated by inferior-quality antibody. In influenza, original antigenic sin has been shown to reduce the effectiveness of vaccination (13, 34, 51). In dengue, the effect of original antigenic sin has considerable bearing on vaccine strategies. Once a response has been established, it is unlikely that repeat boosting will be able to change its scope, meaning that balanced responses against the four virus serotypes will need to be established with the first vaccine dose."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3014204

Re: Pfizer and Biontech provide update on Omicron variant

#628

Post by microtherion »

freeflight wrote: post #406
freemint wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason why people are obsessed with case numbers and not deaths is that case numbers control the case numbers in the insufficiently immunized which predicts death toll 3 weeks ahead of time. Why would you want to control a system with 2-3 weeks of additional lag in your input data when case numbers (a thing that is somewhat easy to measure) correlates so well future deaths? Ideally politician would have some fami…

> Why would you want to control a system with 2-3 weeks of additional lag in your input data when case numbers (a thing that is somewhat easy to measure) correlates so well future deaths? Because case numbers are actually not easy to measure. I'm basing this of my personal experience working in a German healthcare company, we took up testing during the pandemic; All the tests we do are on unvaccinated people. That's…

I'm sure you're right regarding sampling bias, but the vaccinated people I know have not turned off their phone contact tracing alerts, and get tested if they receive a tracing notice.

Re: Pfizer and Biontech provide update on Omicron variant

#629

Post by robotmay »

dang wrote: post #622
robotmay wrote: post #438

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not censorship if people just think you're fucking idiots.

Attacking another user like this is not ok here, regardless of how wrong they are or you feel they are. If you'd please review https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and stick to the rules when posting here, we'd appreciate it.

There's nothing relevant that I can see in the rules other than "be kind". These people are anti-vaxxers and therefore they are themselves unkind by definition because of their selfishness and danger they place vulnerable people in. They deserve no kindness in return when they spout their bullshit on here and whine when they get downvoted. They are anti-science and cruel.

Re: Pfizer and Biontech provide update on Omicron variant

#630

Post by ifyoubuildit »

dahart wrote: post #565
ifyoubuildit wrote: post #551

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't speak for parent, I'll leave that to them. I just meant to show evidence that because something is approved by the majority doesn't disqualify it from being tyrannical. Personally, I don't see why it wouldn't be a concern with the mandates, but I think this conversation has already been repeated by others ad nauseum: I say bodily autonomy, you might say we mandate all sorts of vaccines, I say these aren't tho…

> I say bodily autonomy, you might say we mandate all sorts of vaccines […] talk to me in 5 or 10 years when we have long term data It’s strange to me that the arguments against vaccines are all self-centered, about personal risk, and the arguments in favor are all addressing net social benefit. I kinda want the bodily autonomy to not get infected by someone refusing to take any social precautions over political beli…

We're going to have to agree to disagree on your usage of autonomy there, but your point is taken. We should be looking out for each other, and I think you'd find that a lot of people probably are, even if they disagree with you about various covid/vaccine issues.

Regular testing, distancing, masking, foregoing normal activities are examples of other ways to look out for each other. Maybe I'm crazy, but I think we'll eventually find that folks who just got vaccinated and went about life like normal probably caused more spread than folks who didn't but kept up all the other precautions. I think if you assume everyone thats going about it differently from you is selfish, you're going to be missing chunks of the picture.

> We have more than enough data already...

And this is where we find our difference in beliefs/biases. Same for your opinions on what is and isn't tyranny, which you're welcome to.

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