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Microsoft to acquire ZeniMax Media and Bethesda Softworks for $7.5B

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Re: Microsoft to acquire ZeniMax Media and Bethesda Softworks for $7.5B

#621

Post by zaptrem »

ketzo wrote: post #528
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For now I think we'll wait and see; while the big companies slowly poison the well with microtransactions and live services, ruining games to push for sales, the indie market is massive, turning single developers pottering around in their proverbial basements into millionaires and spawning franchises left and right. I mean Minecraft started off like that. Terraria is following behind it. Among Us, a $4 game on Steam…

I think the real worry would be Steam (Valve) being acquired. Without such a ubiquitous and relatively open platform for distribution, indie devs would have a much harder time making any money.

Considering their flat structure and Gabe Newell’s aversion to outside control/anything that might compromise his team’s vision, I don’t think Valve will be on the table for many years.

Re: Microsoft to acquire ZeniMax Media and Bethesda Softworks for $7.5B

#622

Post by tubularhells »

mcphage wrote: post #592
tubularhells wrote: post #396

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From a gamedev friend, there is no money on macOS. iOS and apple arcade is a viable option, but on Steam, the macOS sales are not worth the headache support and development gives you. Lots of quirks to work around with macOS, and more to come with the ARM transition as apple will surely blame developers for performance problems with x86 titles. Not to mention that the yearly developer fees that you have to pay to kee…

> but on Steam, the macOS sales are not worth the headache support and development gives you. [...] Not to mention that the yearly developer fees that you have to pay to keep a game's long tail on the store. What yearly developer fees do you need to pay to keep a macOS game on Steam? Is it to Valve?

Nothing yearly for Steam, it's a one-off fee, I think about 100 USD these days (it changed over the years). For the macOS store it is a 100 USD a year or so, and of course they take their cut from your sales. I prefer Valve's way of doing business.

Re: Microsoft to acquire ZeniMax Media and Bethesda Softworks for $7.5B

#623

Post by Noos »

sleepybrett wrote: post #359
echelon wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most developers don't work with them, and their customers represent a tiny less "gaming educated" population. That's a bit insulting. Mario and Zelda are a few of the consistently best game franchises. Smash Bros gamers aren't "uneducated" > It's like using cellphone games as a gauge on the greater market. The mobile game market is bigger than the console and PC market.

The switch is also a huge market for indie devs now. Just a crazy amount of indie games in the switch market. Hell one company, Brace Yourself Games, leveraged their game 'Crypt of the Necrodancer' into a connected zelda licensed game called 'Cadence of Hyrule' that just won some awards. The whole 'Nintendo is a thing unto itself' narrative is fading quickly.

It still is, though.

I mean, a part of the reason why indie titles work there is that Nintendo is refusing to offer a AAA gamepass, is using underpowered hardware and is charging a price premium for it. They very much are resisting trends and are their own thing, and it's kind of hard to really use them as a long term market barometer because it can and will backfire as often as it works.

They also kind of are in uncharted waters too. This is now the first time I think they don't have a dedicated handheld and home console, and just have one platform. A lot of why they were able to survive mistakes was having the handheld market as an evergreen to fall back on.

Re: Microsoft to acquire ZeniMax Media and Bethesda Softworks for $7.5B

#624

Post by tubularhells »

b0rsuk wrote: post #399
tubularhells wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Steam has been good to me with their native Linux client, Linux client support, proton compatibility tools and community tool support (glorious eggroll proton version). Epic has nothing to offer me. Furthermore, I know some gamedevs personally who release an early access level title with exclusivity deal on epic's playform just so that they gain access to further funding to finish the game and release on Steam for th…

Phoenix Point was a game I cared about a lot. Then one day, they announced they would not be making a Linux version. Not long after they announced it will be Epic exclusive for a year.

I feel ya, I dropped it so hard I even forgot the game until reading your post.

Re: Microsoft to acquire ZeniMax Media and Bethesda Softworks for $7.5B

#625

Post by epicide »

johnnyanmac wrote: post #476
qchris wrote: post #451

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I began gaming for the first time (unless you count playing on my roommates' XBox in college) this past week, mostly for The Witcher 2/3--both on Linux. The Witcher 3 was never supposed to run on my platform, but somehow Steam and Proton/Wine made that not only possible but actually enjoyable. I know technically they're doing it to make money, but I can't help like feel it's also something of a labor of love as well.…

If you want to be cynical, Proton was made from the scraps of a contingency plan that was the Steam Machine. When they realized that Microsoft wasn't going to force their platform onto users, they gave up on Steam Machines and I guess they leveraged the tech to something else.

Yep, and Post-Its were made from the scraps of what was supposed to be a really strong adhesive.

It speaks more to me that they released Proton rather than shelving it after losing the original motive.

Re: Microsoft to acquire ZeniMax Media and Bethesda Softworks for $7.5B

#626

Post by basch »

WorldMaker wrote: post #553
macspoofing wrote: post #486

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Owning id Tech 6 is or should be a play against Epic, Unity, Crytek etc. Does Microsoft even want to compete against their customers/partners in this space? After all, MS may not want to alienate them to the point they won't release their games for the Xbox.

Microsoft is a developer company and their oldest division is developer tools. They've made several attempts into the game engine / game engine adjacent space over the years, though rarely saw wins outside of low level DirectX. (XNA will be most remembered as an indie dev play, but a key piece of XNA was its content pipeline and Microsoft tried but didn't succeed that well at trying to replace the mostly mish-mash of…

I honestly don't see it being the kind of competition that ruffles those feathers. Microsoft wants developers developers developers to fill Game Pass and run their Infrastructure on Azure, and Microsoft Hearts Open Source. Microsoft open sourcing id Tech 6, and then saying Azure/XboxStore is the best places to build your game and host it, regardless of which engine you want, is the cold war, mutually assured rising tide raises all boats, kind of competition.

What Microsoft doesn't want is Epic or Google getting all the power, becoming the standard, and then being able to strongarm them. Competition, especially open competition, keeps the players more honest.

It's just another entry on this page, albeit a strong one. https://dotnet.microsoft.com/apps/gaming

Re: Microsoft to acquire ZeniMax Media and Bethesda Softworks for $7.5B

#627

Post by tubularhells »

sangnoir wrote: post #525
tubularhells wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Steam has been good to me with their native Linux client, Linux client support, proton compatibility tools and community tool support (glorious eggroll proton version). Epic has nothing to offer me. Furthermore, I know some gamedevs personally who release an early access level title with exclusivity deal on epic's playform just so that they gain access to further funding to finish the game and release on Steam for th…

> Steam has been good to me with their native Linux client, Linux client support, proton compatibility tools and community tool support (glorious eggroll proton version) Reminder: Valve was forced to double-down on SteamOS/Linux by Microsoft's then-intention to shutdown 3rd-party storefronts on Windows. I have a complicated relationship with both Steam (as a Proton user) and Epic (for pulling Linux support on a multi…

Yes, but they have been owning that decision ever since. If that ever changes, I will reconsider. Until then they have me as a customer.

Re: Microsoft to acquire ZeniMax Media and Bethesda Softworks for $7.5B

#628

Post by chx »

Where's the money? Wherever I look I can only find revenue for the gaming industry but I can't find any profit forecasts. Example: https://venturebeat.com/2020/01/02/superdata-games-hit-120-1... or https://variety.com/2019/gaming/news/video-games-300-billion...

Does anyone have better data?

Re: Microsoft to acquire ZeniMax Media and Bethesda Softworks for $7.5B

#629

Post by Noos »

acolumb wrote: post #412
francis_t_catte wrote: post #22

Soon we'll just have Microsoft, Epic, and a conglomeration of EA, Activision, and Ubisoft after Bobby Kotick forces them all to merge. Facebook will bungle up any chance they have of capturing the gaming market after writing a cryptic paragraph about their legal right to request blood samples from all Oculous users in the TOS. Valve will quietly exit software development altogether, and pivot to building custom vanit…

I find that funny when Among Us (indie) and Fall Guys (also indie) are some of the highest-trending games at the moment.

Both of them are free, though. The former one only got this push due to streamers suddenly playing it together. These are kind of "meme of the moment" games more than anything, in the same way VR Chat was a bit ago, or Five Nights at Freddy's.

Re: Microsoft to acquire ZeniMax Media and Bethesda Softworks for $7.5B

#630

Post by DiabloD3 »

kleiba wrote: post #195
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You could make the argument that because of Steam having such reach / monopoly on the PC gaming market, Steam (and by extension Valve) is effectively the publisher of games like that, and a very large one at that. There's GoG that mostly focuses on vintage games, and Epic that spends tons of money to get (timed?) exclusives on indie games + free handouts, but I'm not sure how well it's working for them to get market…

Correct me if I'm wrong, but was id actually involved in the 2009 Wolfenstein or in New Order? I think not. However, they did develop Doom 2016...

They are involved for the technical aspects beyond merely MachineGames using id engines. MachineGames in a lot of ways acts like another id software studio, but it is free to form its own flavor.

MachineGames also has (uncredited?) work on Doom 2016 and Doom Eternal.

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