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New MacBook Pro Is Not a Laptop for Developers Anymore

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Re: New MacBook Pro Is Not a Laptop for Developers Anymore

#621

Post by sliverstorm »

kenoph wrote: post #605
Spartan-S63 wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a fellow Vim user, I don't use the escape key anymore. It's awkward to hit and I rebind it to "jj" (or more recently "jk"). It's unergonomic to reach for the escape key where it customarily is. If it were where Caps Lock is, it would make much more sense. That said, I don't like rotating my hand or remove my fingers from the home row. It's really a non-issue because you can rebind keys so easily, it's not even fun…

I tried "jk" but I hated seeing the cursor pause every time I used "j" to go down.

That doesn't seem right- I use "jj" to escape insert mode and nothing unusual happens when I use hjkl to navigate in normal mode. The only "pause" is when I type the letter "j" in insert mode.

Re: New MacBook Pro Is Not a Laptop for Developers Anymore

#622

Post by JasonSage »

Ph0X wrote: post #560
rhapsodic wrote: post #479

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Esc is, by and large a useless key I'm not a Mac User, but I use THE ESC key extensively to cancel out of dialogs.

I hear all this talk about no more ESC key, but couldn't they potentially just put one up there on the bar, albeit not a real clickable key?

There will be one, they've shown it in some of the promotional imagery. I think everybody is just up in arms about the physical key being gone.

I'm a heavy vim user and use the ESC key all the time. If I get the new MacBook Pro I'll probably see how the touch key works, and then rebind if it's necessary. It's not the end of the world.

Re: New MacBook Pro Is Not a Laptop for Developers Anymore

#623

Post by sliverstorm »

Spartan-S63 wrote: post #371
bisby wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a vim user, esc is pretty important. I would say the author clearly knows very little computer specs: "The MacBook Pro had options with 2.4 gigahertz dual-core processors back in 2010. Anything new in 2016? Not really, well… nope." Because a 2010 2.4ghz dual core is identical to a 2016 2.4 ghz dual core.... I thought we got over comparing processors purely by their clock speed a long time ago. (I will agree that t…

As a fellow Vim user, I don't use the escape key anymore. It's awkward to hit and I rebind it to "jj" (or more recently "jk"). It's unergonomic to reach for the escape key where it customarily is. If it were where Caps Lock is, it would make much more sense. That said, I don't like rotating my hand or remove my fingers from the home row. It's really a non-issue because you can rebind keys so easily, it's not even fun…

If it were where Caps Lock is, it would make much more sense

Which, interestingly, is where ESC was on the computer that vim was first written for.

Re: New MacBook Pro Is Not a Laptop for Developers Anymore

#624

Post by satysin »

The Esc key is annoying but not a big deal for me. What I am worried about is the new butterfly switches. I have used a MacBook with butterfly switches quite a bit and it is not a nice writing experience. It feels like I am using a Blackberry or old Nokia phone.

With Bash on Ubuntu on Windows I think my next machine will be a Dell XPS 15 or ThinkPad T560. Probably the Dell as it comes with a quad-core for like £50 more. Plus a nicer screen (according to reviews).

Re: New MacBook Pro Is Not a Laptop for Developers Anymore

#625

Post by greendragon »

messe wrote: post #581
geofft wrote: post #521

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you use to get out of insert mode? Like, you've just finished typing some text and want to save and quit, what do you press? EDIT: Thanks for the replies, other people. I personally use ^C, I was curious what 'mozumder specifically used. :)

I have `jk` mapped to that in my vimrc. It's far nicer than ESC.

I love jk, been using that one for at least 8 years. I even got in the habit of tapping it a few times while thinking, sort of like how you might sometimes shake your leg or whatever. I trained myself off of that though when I had to use Eclipse more and more -- edits or undoes to a file can bring Eclipse to its knees....

Re: New MacBook Pro Is Not a Laptop for Developers Anymore

#626

Post by nfriedly »

I'm a developer with a 2-year-old macbook pro right now, and while I'm not going to run out and buy a brand new one right now, I wouldn't have a problem with the new ones if it were time to upgrade today. I'd have to replace my thunderbolt 2 dock with a thunderbolt 3 one (or maybe just a dongle?), and I'd probably want at least one USB-A dongle, but meh... it doesn't seem like a big deal to me.

I rarely use the function keys, and aside from exiting full-screen youtube videos, I don't use escape all that often either. I can imagine I'd use the new touch bar at least as much as I use that current row of buttons.

I do think it's funny that Macbooks are now standardized on USB-C + headphones, while iPhones aren't.

Re: New MacBook Pro Is Not a Laptop for Developers Anymore

#627

Post by hellofunk »

alexeysemeney wrote: post #606

folks, thanks for all your comments, didn't expect that. The main issue with the keys appears when you have a full-size keyboard and a laptop with a different set of major keys. And there is one more thing — tactile feedback.

In your experience getting actual work done with the new touch bar, what was your personal feedback on how it felt not to have the tactile feedback?

Re: New MacBook Pro Is Not a Laptop for Developers Anymore

#628

Post by sliverstorm »

mikeash wrote: post #337

I'm always amazed at how techies are so often unable to consider other people's points of view. You'd think I'd be used to it by now, but no. If you don't like the new design, that's totally fine. I've seen a lot of people saying that. But when you say that the new design is bad for everybody , or bad for millions of people you haven't met, based solely on your own personal reasons, you've lost it. I'm a developer. T…

But when you say that the new design is bad for everybody...

It's a little funny, considering the inverse of this is basically a core plot point in "Silicon Valley". Life imitates art imitates life.

Re: New MacBook Pro Is Not a Laptop for Developers Anymore

#629

Post by lambda »

bisby wrote: post #284
ericjang wrote: post #37

I dislike this post intensely. The opinion comes across as uncharitable, as the author probably has not used this Macbook Pro yet. How can you (alexeysemeney) be so sure? I consider myself a developer, and I almost never use the Fn and ESC keys on my Mac. Everybody uses the computer differently, but I'm pretty sure this is not a deal-breaker for most. One could also argue that the touch bar might lead to innovative d…

As a vim user, esc is pretty important. I would say the author clearly knows very little computer specs: "The MacBook Pro had options with 2.4 gigahertz dual-core processors back in 2010. Anything new in 2016? Not really, well… nope." Because a 2010 2.4ghz dual core is identical to a 2016 2.4 ghz dual core.... I thought we got over comparing processors purely by their clock speed a long time ago. (I will agree that t…

The processor speed is less important to me. But the lack of more than 16 GB of RAM is a serious problem. As a developer, I frequently run a large number of VMs at once. My current laptop has 16 GB of RAM, and I frequently need more to run all of the VMs that I need, so I wind up having to use my workstation with has 32 GB of RAM, and just connect to that remotely when I'm on my laptop. That's cumbersome and doesn't work well when I'm on the road in places with flaky connectivity (I travel a lot, as I work remotely and come into the office, so being able to do all of my work on my laptop would be a big win).

The escape key issue doesn't bother me as much, but I'm not a Vim user and I already have Caps Lock mapped to escape or control depending on whether it's a modifier or not. I do use the function keys occasionally in cross-platform development tools like gitk, but I'm sure that other keybindings can be substituted and I'd be able to deal with that.

But the lack of RAM beyond 16 GB pretty much means there's no reason for me to upgrade from my 3 year old laptop. I would have considered upgrading this cycle if they offered more RAM, but as it is I'll probably hold off. Maybe if they release another in a year or so with more RAM I'll upgrade; if not, I may just switch to a Lenovo or other laptop that has more expansion room.

3 years without a bump in RAM capacity seems like an awful lot. I realize that Moore's Law is flattening out, but stagnating for 3 years like this seems like a long time.

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