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The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

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Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#611

Post by unholiness »

mothballed wrote: post #583
freeopinion wrote: post #578

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you offer the public FDA-inspected cinnamon for a 20% premium over not-inspected-and-may-contain-dangerous-levels-of-lead cinnamon, a lot of people will pay the premium. But a large percentage of people will opt for the cheaper cinnamon. If you let it be known that the FDA inspection amounts to a high school dropout trying to read a manifest on a shipping container full of imported cinnamon, a lot more people will…

I would just let the airlines pick if they want TSA screening or not. Customers could buy flights with whatever security level they want. If you fly intrastate in Alaska there is no screening on commercial flights (it seems TSA must not be required on non-interstate flights). Technically it's still illegal to bring a gun but no one would know one way or the other. It really didn't bother me that there was no security…

Security is a classic example of a public good where this doesn't work well. The cheapest ways to secure an airport (sharing queues, staff, protocols, machines, training, threat models) are going to also benefit those who opt out, creating a tragedy of the commons.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#612

Post by kube-system »

ibejoeb wrote: post #178
kube-system wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The mission, ostensibly, is to make air travel safe by ensuring that passengers don't bring dangerous items onto the plane. No, it is to make it safe for any reason, which goes beyond whether or not they brought box cutters.

Ok, I'll concede that. That boils down to someone bringing something on the plane that can be used to cause trouble.

That could be... themselves.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#613

Post by joking »

smelendez wrote: post #328
prashantsengar wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tangential: Here in India we have security guards with hand-held metal detectors in malls, railway stations, and urban transit rails (metro) stations. The first time I visited a different country I was surprised to see my friend accompany me to the check-in counter and even further to drop me off. In India they wouldn't let you enter the airport if your flight doesn't depart soon enough.

It used to be normal in the U.S. to walk people to the gate until 9/11. Now you can escort someone to the check-in counter and up to the security checkpoint, and meet people at the luggage area to help with bags. But in practice it seems rare to do so if there isn’t a particular reason, probably because you’d have to pay to park or ride transit and it’s usually a trek beyond that. Honestly if they allowed you to go t…

not letting outside people at the luggage area seems fine to me, if anyone could enter there the number of stolen baggage would skyrocket.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#614

Post by shrx »

BowBun wrote: post #596
paxys wrote: post #23

It's hilarious how transparent a money grab this entire thing is. "You need to show a Real ID for security, otherwise how do we know you won't hijack the plane?" "Well I don't have a Real ID." "Ok then, give us $45 and you can go through." So it was never about security at all then, was it? And don't get me started with all the paid express security lanes. Because of course only poor people can weaponize shoes and la…

TSA pre-check, Global Entry, and Clear _infuriate_ me. It is privatization of public transportation and a net negative for society. In New York, JFK has closed off half of the security entrances for priority lanes, meaning a majority of passengers are forced into 50% of the entrances. The airport was built with state+federal funds, and now tax-paying residents are second-class to those who can afford $100/year. It's…

Airlines are not public transportation. Usually they're all privatized.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#615

Post by kube-system »

AngryData wrote: post #240
kube-system wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are more criteria to get through security than "not carrying prohibited items". Several of those are dependent on identity, which is why they verify identity.

It seems to me that all those other consideration only matter for international travel, while for domestic travel its an obvious waste of time from every angle.

Why would you think that? All four of the hijacked flights that led to the creation of the TSA were domestic flights.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#616

Post by scott_w »

graemep wrote: post #543
kelnos wrote: post #499

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Er, I don't get it. I do the same thing at every airport in the US: walk off the plane and straight into a taxi.

I think the point is that some people expect security even where it would be pointless.

Basically this. She was confusing Customs with Security, I think.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#617

Post by raw_anon_1111 »

duskdozer wrote: post #310
raw_anon_1111 wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And exactly what good does that do? The government already has your face tied to your ID and knows you’re flying

- 2D ID photo vs 3D scan - ID photo is x years out of date - old identifying info + new identifying info is more valuable than just old identifying info - if it really doesn't matter, then why do they need to collect it? they can just not collect it, since it doesn't matter.

Neither does a 3D scan like an iPhone. As far as facial recognition better because it has up to date pictures. This has been solved without up to date pictures for years. My phone can - on device recognize my son from the time he was 9 to today at 25. If my phone can do it on device, do you think this is a hard problem on a server farm?

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#618

Post by scott_w »

kelnos wrote: post #499
scott_w wrote: post #491

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’d hazard that this may be true now, but this feeling was created by the same “security measures” we’re discussing. Slight tangent but I recall travelling within the Schengen Zone for the first time and just walking off the plane and straight into a taxi. When I explained what I did to someone she asked "but what about security? How do they know you've not got a bomb?" I don't think I had the words to explain that…

Er, I don't get it. I do the same thing at every airport in the US: walk off the plane and straight into a taxi.

Neither did I, thus why I didn’t really know how to respond.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#619

Post by ghaff »

ralferoo wrote: post #547
K0balt wrote: post #517

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Welcome to the club. I inadvertently traveled with not one, but two large box cutters in my carryon satchel for at least 20 flights before I discovered them while searching for some swag. I put them in there for a booth setup in Vegas years prior. Sent a completely calm, even sympathetic report to the powers that be, got put on the DNF list for my troubles. Still screened and detained 100 percent of the time, sometim…

> Sent a completely calm, even sympathetic report to the powers that be, got put on the DNF list for my troubles. What were you hoping to achieve by sending that report? Most people would have just thought "wow, lucky I wasn't caught with that", taken it out of the bag so it didn't happen again and carried on with their lives. Deviating from that normal response makes it look like you're just trying to cause trouble.

Yeah, if I had a "Crap, what was that doing in there?" I'd be very quiet about it.

As I wrote in a very different thread, I avoid putting anything in baggage that I might carryon that is even marginally prohibited. I used to do a lot more travel and it's inevitable that knives and the like would inevitable get left in a pocket.

Re: The TSA's New $45 Fee to Fly Without ID Is Illegal

#620

Post by raw_anon_1111 »

monksy wrote: post #408
anonymars wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does facial recognition work better with one photo or many?

Training requires a lot of photos and face models need to be more recent to be effective.

And yet my iPhone can recognize my son from the time he was 9 to the time he is 25 with just one shot labeling…
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