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Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

modernengineeringmarvels.com

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Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#611

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

Toutouxc wrote: post #494
SV_BubbleTime wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Also... how do you know there aren't Hawaiians charging their EVs using rooftop solar? Because of math. A 6 kW house, to charge a 60 kW battery… so long as everyone with an electric vehicle is charging them at their house for 10 sunny hours to charge from empty, you’re right and I’m wrong. Some people could get by, but it leaves the solar for nothing else. If you leave the house while the sun is up you better get b…

Dude, literally every single EV-related number you’ve mentioned around here is so insanely off. Two hours at a charger, 20 minutes of charge just to get home, charging an EV 0 to 100 % and now again, charging a 60 kW battery every day. I don’t know what kind of terrible EVs you’ve seen, but they weren’t what normal people drive. Either get some real world experience with EVs or just stop posting about them.

Interesting… so, for reference I’m an automotive engineer and have worked one at least three EV platforms for big4.

Good to know how wrong I am on this topic. Let me guess, you own an EV? Well, that certain explains it everything.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#612

Post by SV_BubbleTime »

Toutouxc wrote: post #266
SV_BubbleTime wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

20 minutes to get you home if there is a free charger, ok. Zero to a hundred, you know that isn’t even remotely true.

My cheap EV gets 200+ km of range (124 mi) from 20 minutes of charging. Again, why the hell are you talking about two hours. Why are you saying that 20 minutes gets you "home". Why are you talking about charging from 0 to 100 % when that's NOT how you charge an EV, ever. Sounds like you've never driven one.

No. It doesn’t.

Your display says that. And your display is bullshit.

I work with the people that make the displays man. There are entire groups dedicated to deciding what is indefensible lies, and what “could be true under the right circumstances so we’re allowed to say/show that”

> Why are you talking about charging from 0 to 100 % when that's NOT how you charge an EV,

lol, go to a charging station sometime and see the people sleeping or watching tv. If it’s your primary vehicle and you want to go somewhere, you are going from 0 to 100.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#613

Post by PeterStuer »

angulardragon03 wrote: post #257
PeterStuer wrote: post #230

On my non EV car I seldom use the break unless in an emergency or I have to come to a full stop. I always use the cruise control to decelerate and accelerate. Anyone else has that habit?

… how do you think the cruise control decelerates you? Is this a troll post?

At least on the cars I had over the years, it does not apply the brakes. Depending on how far it is from the target, it lets of the trottle and it uses engine breaking.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#614

Post by Ajedi32 »

empath75 wrote: post #496
altairprime wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If all of us renters were forced to convert to electric there’d never be an open charger in any city again for the next five years, because no landlord will voluntarily afford that cost, and no municipal region can pass a ballot measure to afford that cost. California’s impending ban of combustion car sales hinges wholly on a magical DC-charging network that doesn’t exist in U.S. cities yet (i.e. at parking meters),…

Demand induces supply. Probably don't ban it _all at once_, but a gradual phasing out will give plenty of time for chargers to get built. They won't be _free_, but they will be available.

Demand induces higher prices which induces supply. So yes this is 100% solvable by normal market forces, but that doesn't change the fact that it would be very expensive for everyone involved.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#615

Post by sofixa »

1234letshaveatw wrote: post #562
sofixa wrote: post #521

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm sure you feel the same way about cutting down on cell phones right How many people die in cell phone accidents yearly where you live? How many have reduced lifespans due to the pollution of cell phones? And how many hours can be saved per year per human with good cell phone sharing? I would guess the number is 0 for all of those, but quite a bit higher for cars alternative transportation options. If you feel pe…

Do you have any idea how many hours the average person uses their phone? There is no other object that has been a greater detriment to mental and physical health in human history. This is just another instance where someone is willing to push something (only using public transport) on someone else because it fits their viewpoint, but you can't even consider something that would have a similar impact on yourself in re…

> Do you have any idea how many hours the average person uses their phone

Irrelevant on the topic of there being more efficient modes of transportation of humans in dense environments.

> There is no other object that has been a greater detriment to mental and physical health in human history

While potentially true, that's entirely ignoring all the extremely useful things people do with their phones.

> only using public transport

The fact that you take a mention of providing alternatives to cars as a stance on "only using public transport" indicates to me that you're not interested in having an actual discussion, and your car is part of your core identity. None of that is healthy, so again, step back and consider the benefits. Even purely selfishly, more people out of cars because they can bike or take the train is better for you because there will be less traffic for you.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#616

Post by Sohcahtoa82 »

tonymet wrote: post #580

You can get similar results with proper deceleration, engine braking and downshifting. I’ve had brake pads last 110k miles (with room for 20k+ more), even though I lived in moderate hilly area. That’s probably 1/3 the brake dust, and comparable to an EV . If you are getting lower MPG than the EPA rating, you are also burning up your brakes from heavy deceleration. Improve your MPG to 15% over EPA and your brakes will…

> If you are getting lower MPG than the EPA rating, you are also burning up your brakes from heavy deceleration. Improve your MPG to 15% over EPA and your brakes will last a lot longer.

100%.

People need to understand that the brake pedal is an evil device that converts your cash into brake dust and heat, so use it as little as possible.

Stop accelerating so much in stop-and-go traffic. Drop the "You have to tailgate or else people get in front of you" nonsense attitude. Release the gas sooner when approaching a red light. And for fuck's sake, stop hitting the brakes when you're only trying to shave off a couple mph, especially when going up hill.

I've gotten better-than-EPA mileage on every car I've owned, and I don't even drive slow. Always at or slightly above the speed limit. Economy is all about speed management, not absolute speed, until you're going 75+ mph.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#617

Post by MSFT_Edging »

kstrauser wrote: post #532
MSFT_Edging wrote: post #487

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know for a fact you can neutral-drop a prius. I know it's not exactly the same, but I was a teenager and curious, and you can rev them and shift into drive with some heel-toe finesse. Not sure if this works on the newer ones, this one was an early 2010s model.

Thank you for performing the experiment I didn’t even know I wanted to know the results of before now.

I performed many experiments on that family prius and with complete honestly, my experiments weren't even in the top ten worst things that car survived.

Trees, multiple motorcycles, final destination esque road debris, an accident that should have totalled it if not for an insurance mistake, leading to repairs worth more than the car. Three teenage drivers and two adult drivers with heavy feet. Not to mention many many hardware store runs hauling various sacks of yard materials, baby trees, lumber, etc.

My favorite times were rallying on compacted un-plowed snow. The thin tires and light weight meant it absolutely shredded.

It's my opinion that the Toyota Prius is one of the greatest vehicles ever built and they should be respected and feared.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#618

Post by ARandumGuy »

numpad0 wrote: post #389
tbrownaw wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Effectiveness of regenerative braking depends on having an extremely large battery that can sink enough current to stop the car. An EV can do that, hybrids at best help the brakes out some. You just can't charge the battery fast enough doing anything but a very slow rolling stop. This seems a bit exaggerated. Staying regenerative-only does require sticking to about half or so of how fast I could stop, but so far th…

It's just that Tesla didn't spend skill points on brake blending tech unlockable. Some people confuse it as being a piece of technology of its own. Every other EVs and HVs assign first half of brake pedal for regen and bottom half for mechanical brakes. Tesla uses bottom half of gas pedal for the same, which eliminates the need to accurately determine the appropriate pedal force that corresponds to intended braking f…

This is something that's always baffled me about Teslas. I have a Prius, and regenerative breaking being tied to the break pedal is easy and intuitive. It also means I can easily lift my foot of the gas pedal to coast. IDK it just seems like a much better design to have one "stop" pedal and one "go" pedal, vs one "stop" pedal and one "go/stop" pedal.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#619

Post by kstrauser »

MSFT_Edging wrote: post #617
kstrauser wrote: post #532

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for performing the experiment I didn’t even know I wanted to know the results of before now.

I performed many experiments on that family prius and with complete honestly, my experiments weren't even in the top ten worst things that car survived. Trees, multiple motorcycles, final destination esque road debris, an accident that should have totalled it if not for an insurance mistake, leading to repairs worth more than the car. Three teenage drivers and two adult drivers with heavy feet. Not to mention many ma…

That's an amazing testimony to its grit. I could stand to hear more of those stories over the appropriate beverage.

Re: Electric cars produce less brake dust pollution than combustion-engine cars

#620

Post by frollogaston »

mort96 wrote: post #607
frollogaston wrote: post #572

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might not execute the rev-match perfectly every time, esp if you're doing a heel-toe. I think it's also harder on the synchro.

Sure, and I definitely don't rev-match close to perfect every time. I'm just saying you don't have to use the clutch to accelerate your motor all the way from minimum RPM, which it sounded like my parent comment might be suggesting

I think that suggestion was that you're holding the clutch pedal in longer while you bring up the RPMs, compared to upshifting which is faster. The clutch does wear a bit even when "fully" disengaged. But I don't think it matters enough here, just don't leave it like that during a red light.
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