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A $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no stereo, no screen

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Re: A $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no stereo, no screen

#611

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Example #5621 that a simple carbon tax would be miles better than the complex morass of regulations we currently have.

That's overly reductive. 1. Poorer people tend to drive older vehicles, so if you solely encourage higher fuel economies by taxing carbon emissions, then the tax is (at least short-term) regressive. 2. You can work around #1 by applying incentives for manufacturers to make more efficient cars should lead any carbon tax 3. If you just reward companies based on fleet-average fuel economy without regard to vehicle size,…

> 1. Poorer people tend to drive older vehicles, so if you solely encourage higher fuel economies by taxing carbon emissions, then the tax is (at least short-term) regressive.

The idea that policy makers care about this in any meaningful sense is absurd given the EV mandates, as EV's radically change the lifecycle costs of cars in a way that is absolutely destructive to people who aren't wealthy.

EV's lower the 'fueling' cost but shift part of it into large cashflow crushing battery replacement costs.

Automobiles have been a significant engine in elevating less wealthy americans because you can buy a old junky car for very little and keep it limping along with use-proportional fuel costs and minor maintenance. Even if it's an inefficient car, you use it to go to work, so you're making money to pay for the fuel. Less work, less work fuel required.

EV's significantly break the model and will push many more less wealthy people onto predatory financing which they'll never escape. Yet policy makers refuse to even discuss the life-cycle cashflow difference of EVs, and continue to more forward with policies to eventually mandate their use.

> it was almost certain to be wrong in one direction or the other, but it hasn't been updated.

It's been broken all along. We've had decades to fix it.

Re: A $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no stereo, no screen

#612

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's overly reductive. 1. Poorer people tend to drive older vehicles, so if you solely encourage higher fuel economies by taxing carbon emissions, then the tax is (at least short-term) regressive. 2. You can work around #1 by applying incentives for manufacturers to make more efficient cars should lead any carbon tax 3. If you just reward companies based on fleet-average fuel economy without regard to vehicle size,…

Looks like as long as only positive change is allowed to touch the poor, there will be little change.

Going to let us burn because not doing so would be regressive.

Re: A $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no stereo, no screen

#614
post #573

>The rather extreme omission of any kind of media system in the car is jarring, but it, too, has secondary benefits. >“Seventy percent of repeat warranty claims are based on infotainment currently because there’s so much tech in the car that it’s created a very unstable environment in the vehicle,” Snyder says. I'm totally cool with them not having an infotainment screen or even a stereo itself. But speaker managemen…

I'd rather have my Bluetooth speaker stolen than an installed stereo stolen where they just gut parts of the car and rip things up. But it will be a bigger target since it's easier to resell.

> But it will be a bigger target since it's easier to resell.

Indeed: https://www.reddit.com/r/Toyota/comments/1bt8ck8/loved_dropp...

Re: A $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no stereo, no screen

#615
post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Noooooooooo! No apps, please! Finally a car not tethered to and dependent on your phone, and we already have our first request to app-ify it! What car is tied to your phone? A mustang mach-e, for instance, does not require your phone at all. It has a FOB for opening the doors and starting it, you can program the charging times from the in-car screen. The app is optional, exactly as it should be. This car DESPERATELY…

> DESPERATELY is going to need an app when it comes to charging whether you know it or not I don't own an EV. What for? Do you really need more than a button or two and some leds?

In addition to the sibling comment, you want to be able to check if the vehicle is charging and everything is fine remotely. EVs randomly stopping charging for various reasons is not rare at all. You want to get a notification.

You want to know when the vehicle finishes charging so you can vacate the public charger.

You want to be able to reduce the current when the charging is tripping breakers wherever you are.

Re: A $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no stereo, no screen

#617
I could imagine this being popular for company and fleet trucks, but I can't imagine it being popular for personal vehicles with the general public. The people I know who drive personal pickup trucks want the absolute biggest one they can find and have zero interest in actually doing any truck activities with it. They drive their Raptors and 2500s to work and to burger king and that's it. If they do any customization, they might take it to a shop and pay them to put a louder muffler on it.

Re: A $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no stereo, no screen

#618

For anyone curious, if you made a similarly sized gas-powered pickup with an i4 engine, it would be penalized more than a full-sized pickup for being too fuel inefficient, despite likely getting much better mileage than an F-150 because, since 2011, bigger cars are held to a lesser standard by CAFE[1]. 1: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_average_fuel_economy...

Fine print: The truck in the link is only $20K after government subsidies/rebates. So if the government gives my tax dollars to buyers of this truck, then it will cost $20K.

It's ~28k without them, particularly when considering recent inflation it's an attractive price... inflation corrected it's in the vague ballpark of other small IC trucks when they were still available.

E.g. a early 2000's Nissan frontier base model was $23k in today's money. It was a somewhat better speced (e.g. more hauling capacity) and much better range, but this new car likely has significantly lower operating costs that would easily justify a 5k uplift.

So I think it ought to be perfectly viable without the subsidy, especially so long as the absurd CAFE standards continue to exist giving EV's a monopoly on this truck size.

Re: A $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no stereo, no screen

#619

>The rather extreme omission of any kind of media system in the car is jarring, but it, too, has secondary benefits. >“Seventy percent of repeat warranty claims are based on infotainment currently because there’s so much tech in the car that it’s created a very unstable environment in the vehicle,” Snyder says. I'm totally cool with them not having an infotainment screen or even a stereo itself. But speaker managemen…

just place 4 bluetooth speakers connected to eachother in a mesh or something

Re: A $20k American-made electric pickup with no paint, no stereo, no screen

#620
post #11

It's a $20k, street-legal, EV modding platform. Sounds like you can mount your own infotainment system. Just an electric motor, battery, and chassis, and the rest is up to you. Isn't this what we've been asking for?

That's with federal incentive and likely before they factored in the tariffs. Those 500 parts aren't all coming from US. I wouldn't expect any usable version of it to be below 30k once it's actually available.
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