Is there better footage than this weird livestream which abruptly cuts off at 2h:20m? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qmea-M9BvhE&t=8175s
Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
611–620 of 1001 posts
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#612I normally avoid commenting on politics entirely but I feel compelled to comment here. I'm sure anyone who's ever been bullied in their life will feel exactly what's happening in that video clip. Two big kids, confident in their position and backing each other up, gang up on the outsider. Did they ever really want to make a deal at all? Absolutely infuriating and saddening to watch.
Yup. I started having dreams about bullying recently, even before today's scene.
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#613All I can say is that Zelensky is a terrible negotiator. Recognize who you're dealing with, and adjust your stance accordingly. He should have negotiated a little bit but ultimately taken the minerals deal--give Trump the win with his base, and give Trump a reason for the US to join in the fight. Throw in something crazy, like a Trump golf course or a statue or something. He is a simple man to please! These are gener…
> Ukraine doesn't have the cards.
Oh, but they do. We (the west) can't allow them to be overrun.
So if they refuse to accept a deal, what can we really do?
Starving Ukraine for supplies would be extremely dangerous.
(That said: I'm not sure Trump understands this)
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#614Bit of a tangent, but I wondered if anyone here is particularly into the serious business of foreign affairs/international relations, and can recommend a primer -- or even a curriculum -- for someone wanting to become more knowledgeable about the field. As with anything, I suspect one is better able to appreciate the ramifications of events of this sort with a more nuanced and informed perspective.
You could do a lot worse than starting by reading this: https://www.orwellfoundation.com/the-orwell-foundation/orwel...
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#615I wonder what the GOP senators' reactions are to this very sharp turn? They had been strongly supportive of aid to Ukraine, pushing through funding. Maybe that was mostly McConnell and now that he's no longer majority leader, it fell by the wayside? Certainly the "traditional conservative GOP" would be horrified by these events. But maybe all those guys -- McCain, Romney, McConnell, are gone or on their way out.
They are on their way out, they understand what's about to happen.
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#616It was as if they invited him to the Whitehouse to set him up for a lecture and scolding. They had no intention of anything other than humiliating him in front of the world. It's shameful what our administration has done.
Yes this was my first thought. But then I understood that it's most probably the fact that the administration wasn't interested in the outcome of the conversation. My hypotesis is that Trump is living each day as unique, disconnected from the others, in a selfish way. So he didn't care about the consequences of this meeting for Zelenskyy and in general everything else.
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#6171750 comments, why is it #25 on HN? All the while "3,200% CPU Utilization" with 100 comments is #1. Which is niche at best.
As I understand it HN ranking algorithm penalizes controversial threads, as indicated by roughly equal or higher number of comments compared to upvotes or something along those lines.
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#618Bit of a tangent, but I wondered if anyone here is particularly into the serious business of foreign affairs/international relations, and can recommend a primer -- or even a curriculum -- for someone wanting to become more knowledgeable about the field. As with anything, I suspect one is better able to appreciate the ramifications of events of this sort with a more nuanced and informed perspective.
I can recommend every Dwarkesh Patel pod and lecture with Sarah C. M. Paine. History is the best teacher, and that's her specialty. I learned a lot from each of the following:
https://www.dwarkeshpatel.com/p/sarah-paine (WW2, Taiwan, Ukraine, & Maritime vs Continental Powers)
https://www.dwarkeshpatel.com/p/sarah-paine-india
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#619I would like to know what the alternatives are. None that I can think of are palatable: 1. Support Ukraine enough so that Russia doesn't take too much more territory, but not enough for Russia to feel threatened and escalate the war. This was the Biden plan and it sounds like what Europe wants. I just don't see how this ends the war. Is this just buying time for someone to depose Putin? 2. Support Ukraine enough so i…
One obvious alternative is to not to behave like a bully but like a real leader. The US could disengage in much more orderly fashion, if it so pleased.
Re: Zelensky leaves White House after angry meeting
#620George Washington's farewell address (1796) - on Europe: The great rule of conduct for us in regard to foreign nations is in extending our commercial relations, to have with them as little political connection as possible. So far as we have already formed engagements, let them be fulfilled with perfect good faith. Here let us stop. Europe has a set of primary interests which to us have none; or a very remote relation…
Europe in the late 1700s is VERY different than Europe today. I don’t mean in technology or culture. I mean in foreign policy.
These are formally imperialist nations.