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TikTok goes dark in the US

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Re: TikTok goes dark in the US

#611

The app was shutdown a couple of hours ago in the US and this was the message all TikTok users saw when they opened the app.[1] The same guy who pushed for a ban massively last year, is going to save the app despite the security concerns he and most of our government said they had. If only we knew what happened in that classified briefing that made them vote together across party lines. [1] https://a57.foxnews.com/st…

I wonder how much ByteDance got from the incoming administration to pull that stunt. Super shady. "We voluntarily shut down our service in your country (er, I mean, we HAD TO, for real!) but don't worry, a true hero is soon arriving to save the day!"

> ByteDance got from the incoming administration

Why do you assume conspiracy instead of unilateral political maneuvering?

Re: TikTok goes dark in the US

#612
Claude summary of the Supreme Court opinion at: https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/24pdf/24-656_ca7d.pdf

1. Background on TikTok: - Launched in 2017, TikTok has over 170 million U.S. users and 1 billion worldwide - Users create, publish, view, share and interact with short videos with audio and text - Features a personalized "For You" page using a proprietary algorithm - Operated in the U.S. by TikTok Inc. (California-based company) - Ultimate parent company is ByteDance Ltd., a private Chinese company that: - Owns TikTok's algorithm (developed/maintained in China) - Develops portions of TikTok's source code - Is subject to Chinese laws requiring cooperation with intelligence work and government data access

2. Arguments by Petitioners (TikTok & Users): - First Amendment violations due to: - Burden on content moderation and content generation - Restricting access to a distinct medium of expression - Limiting association with preferred speakers/editors - Restricting receipt of information and ideas - Argued the Act should face strict scrutiny as content-based regulation - Claimed divestiture within 270 days is commercially infeasible, making it an effective ban - Argued alternative measures could address security concerns without banning TikTok

3. Arguments by Respondents (Government): - Primary justification: Preventing China from collecting vast amounts of sensitive data from 170M U.S. users - Secondary justification: Preventing foreign adversary control over the recommendation algorithm - Argued for intermediate scrutiny as content-neutral regulation - Cited national security concerns and Chinese laws requiring data sharing - Pointed to failed negotiations with ByteDance for alternative security measures

4. Main Opinion: The Court affirmed the D.C. Circuit's ruling that the Act does not violate the First Amendment, finding: - Applied intermediate scrutiny as the Act is content-neutral - Found compelling government interest in preventing Chinese data collection - Determined the Act is sufficiently tailored to address security concerns - Notable quote: "Data collection and analysis is a common practice in this digital age. But TikTok's scale and susceptibility to foreign adversary control, together with the vast swaths of sensitive data the platform collects, justify differential treatment to address the Government's national security concerns."

5. Concurring Opinions: Justice Sotomayor: - Agreed with outcome but argued First Amendment clearly applies - Cited TikTok's expressive activity in "compiling and curating" material

Justice Gorsuch: - Expressed concerns about rushed timeline (14 days to resolve) - Praised Court for not considering classified evidence hidden from petitioners - Questioned whether law is truly "content neutral" - Agreed government has compelling interest in preventing data harvesting - Found law appropriately tailored after other solutions proved inadequate

6. Dissenting Opinions: None filed.

7. Other Relevant Details: - The Court emphasized the narrow scope of its ruling given the novel technology issues - Showed substantial deference to Congress's national security judgments - The Act was passed with strong bipartisan support (352-65 in House, 79-18 in Senate) - The Court noted but did not rely on classified evidence in reaching its decision

The Supreme Court's ruling allows the Act to take effect, requiring TikTok to either complete a qualified divestiture from Chinese ownership or cease U.S. operations, marking a significant development in the intersection of national security, technology regulation, and First Amendment rights.

Re: TikTok goes dark in the US

#614

I wish we would ban social media for at least 2 days per week, these apps are extremely distracting and will be seen like gambling addiction in the future.

Where's the line? Does hn count?

Where's the line? Does hn count?

It does to a degree but HN by design encourages people to set limits in their profile options with maxvisit, minaway, noprocrast. Self govern rather than govern from above.

Re: TikTok goes dark in the US

#615

The app was shutdown a couple of hours ago in the US and this was the message all TikTok users saw when they opened the app.[1] The same guy who pushed for a ban massively last year, is going to save the app despite the security concerns he and most of our government said they had. If only we knew what happened in that classified briefing that made them vote together across party lines. [1] https://a57.foxnews.com/st…

I have a feeling the ban is likely the result of "special interest" groups as opposed to a "classified briefing"

It’s very telling that the TT ban was not a standalone bill, but rather just one item of a bill that included $26 billion in aid for Israel, $13b for Ukraine and $8b for Taiwan

Congress can’t even agree on the federal govt budget, but they can almost unanimously agree to support war, and banning TT

Re: TikTok goes dark in the US

#616

The app was shutdown a couple of hours ago in the US and this was the message all TikTok users saw when they opened the app.[1] The same guy who pushed for a ban massively last year, is going to save the app despite the security concerns he and most of our government said they had. If only we knew what happened in that classified briefing that made them vote together across party lines. [1] https://a57.foxnews.com/st…

> If only we knew what happened in that classified briefing Most likely, the rationale will be similar to Huawei and Kaspersky. Not based on actual historical misbehaviour, but rather the amount of power you’re allowing their respective governments to have over US citizens / infrastructure. There are very few “from first principals” thinkers in the world, especially amongst TikTok’s younger audience. Most people take…

Therefore, this power to influence younger generations should be restricted to US government and US big tech Corporation. They know what is best for them.

Re: TikTok goes dark in the US

#617

I wonder. Isn't it that type of "ban" that simple VPN to Europe resolve? I wouldn't be surprised if zoomers would watch tutorials how to get vpn on instagram right now.

Depends how it is implemented. If it is just suspension of US accounts, VPN could not help.

Re: TikTok goes dark in the US

#618

It's a shame that it's come to this. I feel that all arguments that TikTok is unhealthy or spyware and bad for our general public are valid, but the same arguments also apply to Instagram/Twitter/Whatever. Rather than have some sort of further regulation for what data any application can collect and present to Americans, we've just brought the hammer down on the millions of people that use this application for their…

“Millions of people that use this application for their livelihood” - citation needed A bit over dramatic. I don’t foresee soup kitchens overflowing from TikTok influencers suddenly unable to house or feed themselves.

Even if that is true, it might be better that they start getting their livelihood somewhere else which makes whole society more healthier.

Re: TikTok goes dark in the US

#620

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Grey zone conflict" sounds a lot like our powers are upset they don't have the level of control over information that the adversary has. They want to be the ones to censor, suppress, and promote, rather than another country. The goal isn't more open access to information.

You make it sound like that's generally a negative thing, implying that the information being promoted by other countries is made equal and has some implicit right to be spread. But it's not, it's geopolitic information warfare.

So we get down to actual situation - TikTok is way too popular and not under reach nor control.

The hell will sooner freeze that me as an European will believe US government is not weaponizing data of all US companies it can get it hands on, and well, it can get hands on all data. That's decade old story at best.

For an European, this is really funny, fight for who can control general population more. Don't get me wrong, I consider all social networks a brain and societal cancer, but to claim one is weaponized and the other is not, pinky promise... Snowden, NSA, secret courts and rulings that can't be even made public, recording basically whole internet traffic for further analysis including this comment (maybe apart from youtube traffic). Discussion who is doing worse is then just an academic one, lets make an Excel spreadsheet and compare numbers.

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