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Voyager 1 stops communicating with Earth

cnn.com

611–620 of 649 posts

Re: Voyager 1 stops communicating with Earth

#611
post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1 million miles per day is an insane figure

You do it every day! The Earth itself moves faster than Voyager -- 1.6 million miles per day.

Doesn’t count. Earth has gravity. It’s immense. It has an atmosphere. Voyager is a tiny little man made craft flying out - naked - into the unknown.

Re: Voyager 1 stops communicating with Earth

#612
post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Hash functions can be used outside of symmetric encryption. Which is the wording I used. In any case, the overall point remains. Short of the one time pad you can’t build a provably flawless scheme.

They can be used outside symmetric encryption, e.g. in signature schemes, but the hashing primitives are part of symmetric cryptography.

Again, I didn’t say symmetric cryptography :)

Re: Voyager 1 stops communicating with Earth

#613
post #282

One of my favorite facts ever is that Voyager 1 contains something called the Voyager Golden Record [1]. It has the following quote written: This is a present from a small, distant world, a token of our sounds, our science, our images, our music, our thoughts and our feelings. We are attempting to survive our time so we may live into yours. I get chills everytime I think about this. I hope we can recover from this ev…

I don't understand the Golden Record. Even assuming other advanced civilizations, "there’s an infinitesimally small chance that the Golden Record will be picked up."[0] So, at some (considerable?) cost and time, something meaningless and ineffective (from the perspective of its ostensible purpose, communicating with alien civilizations) was undertaken. So what was the point? Why was it done? Note, I'm not questioning…

> So what was the point? Why was it done?

You could ask this about any piece of art. Additionally, you could say these questions are, partially, also the function of art.

It's not just the contents that display humanity, it's the fact of sending it that says "we're human". Ultimately, this is more important than gathering data or anything of the sort with a clear, functional purpose.

Re: Voyager 1 stops communicating with Earth

#614

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Placing no time constraints, my gut tells me it’s almost inevitable those breakthroughs will eventually come. Either in mathematics or quantum computing. Or both. Namely I’d ask when not if. My opinion is that short of the one time pad, we won’t come up with provably unbreakable schemes.

> Namely I’d ask when not if. The big assumption of cryptography is that, there exists some problems that are not provably unsolvable but difficult enough for almost any practical purposes. To engineers, no assumption can be more reasonable than that. Given unlimited time, it's a provable fact that any (brand new) processor with asynchronous input signal will malfunction due to metastability in digital circuits, it's…

> your standard may vary.

Agreed. My overall / initial point was that I can’t say the time to crack = the time to brute force and start talking about the age of the universe. Even if we had to wait 10,000 years for cryptanalysis to break AES, it’s a blink of an eye in sideral timescale.

> quantum cryptography

Quantum cryptography is helpful in detecting eavesdropping (due to the no clone theorem). Ie quantum cryptography is helpful in avoiding asymmetric encryption for key exchange when communicating with symmetric encryption. Eg BB84. And given asymmetric encryption is most vulnerable to quantum attacks (compared to symmetric), quantum cryptography improves today’s state of the art. BUT, I insist that none of this gives provably uncrackable schemes.

AND it might be that we never build such a scheme. After all we have Godel’s incompleteness theorem lying around.

Re: Voyager 1 stops communicating with Earth

#615
post #548

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't follow. The wallet is the private key, along with some other info.

The wallet could be encrypted with a strong password and thus inaccessible.

Yes, but any unknown password is enough to put most people off, particular if the contents of the wallet is unknown.

Re: Voyager 1 stops communicating with Earth

#616

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I need an eink display on my office wall showing the current location/status. I always get a tremendous sense of wonder and wellbeing thinking about these probes/achievements, maybe it'd help keep me centered before the daily onslaught.

the current status is that we do not know where it has fared to, according to the title

Some systems seem to be off: https://voyager.jpl.nasa.gov/mission/status/

Re: Voyager 1 stops communicating with Earth

#617
post #382

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We don't even have a world government yet! It's very disorganized still at home to receive guests, I agree.

Have you noticed this correlation that all the governments people find desirable are of tiny little populations? And that the larger a governed population becomes the more of a mixture of dysfunctional, corrupt, and/or authoritarian the government seems to become? I don't really think it's a correlation. It's tough for any given entity to truly represent 10 people, let alone 10 million. And by the time you start spea…

Everything comes down to motivation. When it's you and three other people, you can figure out a system. It's very easy to enforce the system because you all know each other. Not working well lets them down and lets them beat you down.

When it's you and a village, it's still relatively easy to enforce things because you have families and relationships. There's some inefficiency and some corruption from individuals but you can still try and monitor everything.

When it's you and a hundred million people, you could never even meet everyone let alone know them. So you need a thousand steps between. And every step and every system can have corruption and inefficiency. Unless you have some sort of central mandate like religion, it's very hard to motivate people because everyone is so separated. Even if you do, you still get corruption like in china.

Re: Voyager 1 stops communicating with Earth

#618

Earlier quoted context omitted.

s/USAians/Americans/

I don't think the south American Brazilians are anywhere near as prudish as the central north American USofA denizens.

And I didn’t think South Crossers were never told what the A in USofA stands for but here we are.

Re: Voyager 1 stops communicating with Earth

#619

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> even though there was no computer on Earth at the time fast enough to decode it I'm not sure what is meant by that. Not fast enough to decode in real time? There is/was no need to do that. The transmissions would have gone to tape in any case. Here is a link describing how to decode such a tape : https://destevez.net/2021/09/decoding-voyager-1/

I called it a legend deliberately. One of the things I love about this anecdote is that it makes less sense the older and more experienced I get. It was told to me 12 years ago as a young, starry-eyed junior developer by my supervisor who had a PhD in RF research, while we were working on what we considered to be a world-changing wireless technology at a startup in San Francisco (it wasn't). Who knows how many of the…

Sounds like that old legend that the Cray 1 could execute an infinite loop in 7.6 seconds!

Re: Voyager 1 stops communicating with Earth

#620

One of my favorite tech legends is that apparently Voyager 1 launched with a Viterbi encoder, even though there was no computer on Earth at the time fast enough to decode it. After a number of years Moore's Law caught up and they remotely switched over to Viterbi for more efficient transmissions.

That which is imperfect must be sterilized! You MUST sterilize in case of error. Error is inconsistent with my prime function. Sterilization is correction! Everything that is in error MUST be sterilized. There ARE no exceptions. Your data is faulty! I am perfect!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mw3zzMWOIvk

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