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What's SAP?

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Re: What's SAP?

#611

Post by benhurmarcel »

72deluxe wrote: post #140
probably_wrong wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used SAP at work to keep track of monthly working hours. The GUI had this... feature that doesn't allow you to resize the form you're working with. And you can scroll vertically, but the first columns are frozen in place. As a result, only 15% of your screen is usable, showing 4 out of the 30 columns you need to fill at a time and requiring constant scrolling. As a user, I would have been happy to dump it and use a…

Do users just accept this "feature" garbage? I get the feeling they do.

They don't have a choice. You're not going to resign because the software to submit hours has a terrible interface.

Re: What's SAP?

#612

Post by benhurmarcel »

jimnotgym wrote: post #29
hanniabu wrote: post #5

SAP wouldn't be that disheartening to use if it weren't so damn slow and if UI/UX wasn't from the 90s.

In some of the repetitive data entry areas, like forms to enter purchase invoices, it used to have the most productive UI I have ever used. The cursor started in the right box, tabbed to the right places etc. I would swap that screen for my current modern one any day

> The cursor started in the right box, tabbed to the right places etc.

We must have not used the same SAP forms.

Re: What's SAP?

#613

Post by funcDropShadow »

zamalek wrote: post #524
tomnipotent wrote: post #437

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> configuring SAP to do what you want it to do is often on par with writing your own system from scratch. Hyperbole. A lot of working with an ERP is developing middleware or custom modules that implement business-specific logic on top of an existing API and schema. It's like saying building a Facebook App is equivalent to rebuilding the entire Facebook Platform. > So we've dared to build our own multinational and ful…

> A lot of working with an ERP is developing middleware or custom modules that implement business-specific logic Indeed. It does, however, seem that these are developed on a system that isn't designed to intuitively express the degree of logic required - or even trivial logic. There are poor souls slogging through whichever level of hell uses SAP for customer relations, purely because that's the way it's done. That a…

Well, "app quality", you mean those shiny UIs with abysmal usability. Because usability is more about the behavior of a syste m then removal of button edges. ERP and SAP is definetely neither sexy nor hipp nor woke nor does it have an even acceptable usability, but it doesn't have to. It has to help making money. And that's a business, as tough as they come.

Re: What's SAP?

#614

Post by [deleted] »

tripzilch wrote: post #606
tomnipotent wrote: post #589

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> whole operative side of the business needs to reinvent itself in order to conform to the mould the new ERP software requires This is exactly expected and a desired outcome in a vast majority of scenarios. These jobs/roles are not snowflakes.

I've been dependent on businesses that just went through such a transition and it's terrible. It's not a desired outcome at all. The "not snowflakes" good people leave, and the ossified ones who really just keep their head above water and need the job, are what you have to deal with. And they have the exact same attitude to succumb to the system or else you're SOL. I really truly think you do not understand. It's rar…

[deleted]

Re: What's SAP?

#615

Post by thirdsun »

bargle0 wrote: post #204
Proziam wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have to agree. I've had the massive misfortune to have to implement and test (almost?) every open source ERP/CRM system out there from vTiger, Odoo, SuiteCRM, Yeti, NextERP, Dolibarr, ...and more that I can't recall from the top of my head. Each and every one of these systems suck. Sometimes they suck in creative and extraordinary ways. But, one thing you can count on is that there's a real reason that they suck. I…

Which of the open source ERP systems is the least bad?

ERPNext in my opinion: https://erpnext.com/

Re: What's SAP?

#616

Post by tomnipotent »

tripzilch wrote: post #606
tomnipotent wrote: post #589

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> whole operative side of the business needs to reinvent itself in order to conform to the mould the new ERP software requires This is exactly expected and a desired outcome in a vast majority of scenarios. These jobs/roles are not snowflakes.

I've been dependent on businesses that just went through such a transition and it's terrible. It's not a desired outcome at all. The "not snowflakes" good people leave, and the ossified ones who really just keep their head above water and need the job, are what you have to deal with. And they have the exact same attitude to succumb to the system or else you're SOL. I really truly think you do not understand. It's rar…

> I really truly think you do not understand.

Totally. My clearly poorly researched comment and seemingly lack of knowledge on the subject clearly reveals me as a fraud. You got me.

Re: What's SAP?

#617

Post by [deleted] »

tripzilch wrote: post #602
tomnipotent wrote: post #417

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> SAP can do can be done at the local level using intuitive software No they cannot. ERP's are beasts of expert domain knowledge hidden in shitty codebases, but don't be confused for an even a moment to think you can do it yourself. It's a fools errand, and I'd fire or not hire anyone that tried to intentionally do this rather than just build something basic to hedge time until you have to implement something more se…

Your tone sounds a bit insulted, what's the matter? Is it because they called SAP hideous? I don't know what many of the terms mean you name, and I severely doubt that every business (or most) does. Doesn't mean they're not important, but most definitely just firing off a bunch of random terms fully expecting people not to understand most of them, is a weak way to prove a point. I have seen however on the consumer si…

[deleted]

Re: What's SAP?

#618

Post by thirdsun »

fefe23 wrote: post #70

People complaining about how user-unfriendly SAP is or how companies adapt to SAP instead of the other way around are missing the point of SAP. The point of SAP is that the module for your type of business is being implemented at the market leader in your area, because they are the only ones who can afford it. SAP will come to the market leader and put their processes into software. Then everybody else adapts to SAP…

> People complaining about how user-unfriendly SAP is or how companies adapt to SAP instead of the other way around are missing the point of SAP.

> The point of SAP is that the module for your type of business is being implemented at the market leader in your area...

I understand that SAP apparently delivers an insane range of good defaults, complex business transactions and covers any imaginable niche use case. That's valuable.

However why does that rule out friendly, accessable and sane UI? Excellent form design, intuitive navigation and generally things that enable efficient work without weeks of training? That seems like low hanging fruit to me. Something as boring as lists and forms can still be a joy to use if done right.

Re: What's SAP?

#619

Post by tripzilch »

tomnipotent wrote: post #616
tripzilch wrote: post #606

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been dependent on businesses that just went through such a transition and it's terrible. It's not a desired outcome at all. The "not snowflakes" good people leave, and the ossified ones who really just keep their head above water and need the job, are what you have to deal with. And they have the exact same attitude to succumb to the system or else you're SOL. I really truly think you do not understand. It's rar…

> I really truly think you do not understand. Totally. My clearly poorly researched comment and seemingly lack of knowledge on the subject clearly reveals me as a fraud. You got me.

Hey, can you maybe knock it off?!

You've been sending replies to my old comments for the past THREE DAYS, and then editing and deleting them. I got "HN Replies" enabled so they do end up in my mailbox even if you edit or delete them shortly after. So I do get to see EVERY TIME you wrote me in the past couple of days that you believe I am "not qualified to have an opinion. full stop". No discussion, no arguments, not even trying to engage what I said, just attacks telling me over and over how much better you understand SAP. Just attacks or stating your credentials. Which is no discussion but I don't care any more, I want you to knock it off, now.

At this point I honestly don't care what your opinion is on ERP, that you're the Queen of SAP, or whether you think I get to have an opinion or not. You deleted that remark, but it was the straw. I just want to cease communicating with you, which I did from my end already nearly a week ago.

Now I understand when sometimes people post while in a bad mood, causing them to post things they regret. And if you delete those messages, then that is fine with me. But what I'm a little bit worried about, is that I got to wake up to a new reply from you, telling me how stupid I am and that I don't deserve to have an opinion, for the past THREE DAYS. That's not a bad mood. And I don't care what it is. Just let it go, alright?

Please don't reply to this comment with anything less than an apology.

Re: What's SAP?

#620

Post by namdnay »

solarkraft wrote: post #342
kthejoker2 wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google, Apple, and Microsoft do, Amazon does not, based on some moderate Googling for job postings, staff on LinkedIn, and conference attendees.

That's impressive. Of course Apple distributes hardware, so it makes the most sense to me. Microsoft, I suppose, had to distribute Windows boxes at some point, so it makes some sense to me. But I definitely wonder at which point Google started seeing a need for SAP. As soon as they started selling gadgets? Before then, to generally manage finances?

Finance, HR, Office Equipment, Travel Expenses etc...
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