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YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

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Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#611
post #51

This is the 21st century equivalent to burning books.

The lesson in Fahrenheit 451 (the famous book about book burning) is that the laws were initially changed to burn pornography, obscenity and disgusting books, the whole country, everyone, approved these laws, and then the scope widened.....

Policy and mechanism.

A dangerous mechanism introduced to support a good policy is still a dangerous mechanism. Proponents of policies requiring expansions of power should be very careful about the consequences of giving that power to someone with different goals, because that will happen at some point.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#612

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm in favor a well regulated militia. So people can have guns as long as they're in a "well-regulated militia"? Do we want all gun owners to be in self-governed militias? I don't follow this line of thought.

The second amendment states that a well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. I’m no expert on the legalities and legal interpretations of the 2nd amendment but it seems to me a case could be made that well regulated gives the government broad regulatory powers. The mention of militia could be interpreted to mean only members of the…

> The mention of militia could be interpreted to mean only members of the militia, clearly under the command of the military, can own guns.

Rhode Island's 1842 constitution starts like this:

> The liberty of the press being essential to the security of freedom in a state, any person may publish his sentiments on any subject, being responsible for the abuse of that liberty . . . .

So according to you, if the 'security of freedom in a state' is threatened, then the government can suspend the freedom of the press?

Or take 1784 New Hampshire constitution:

> In criminal prosecutions, the trial of facts in the vicinity where they happen, is so essential to the security of the life, liberty and estate of the citizen, that no crime or offence ought to be tried in any other county than that in which it is committed . . . .

So according to you, 'if the trial of the facts in the vicinity where they happen is not essential to the security of the life' (again, in wartime or any exogenous circumstances like 9/11 attacks) then this right of citizens to be tried in the county where the crime was committed can be suspended by the govt whenever they deem fit?

Or maybe, this 'justification clause' which was written in many different ways at many different places by the people of that time is actually 'one and the most important justification' for a right and not 'If and only if trial of the facts in the vicinity ...'.

Let me explain another scenario. The first amendment starts with "Congress shall make no law...". Today we clearly understand it to mean 'US Congress', but in the year 2256, People have created a new legislative body called Congress-22 and now they claim that first amendment only restricts Congress's power to restrict speech. On the other hand Congress-22 still has the power to restrict speech and religion.

Same thing goes with 'militia'. It used to mean "pretty much all able-bodied men from age eighteen to forty-five". This does not mean that it ONLY protects the right of 18-45 men to keep and bear arms, but it cover everyone's right to keep and bear arms.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#613

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Using words that don't mean what you think they mean is a bad argument. Sorry, well-regulated means well trained and in good working order. Militia - is you and I, and anyone else of able body that can fight for defense of self and country. The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. - that's the part you apparently didn't read. Of all the bill of rights, they all apply to people directly -…

I quoted a Supreme Court ruling in which the justices said there was no such right enshrined in the 2nd amendment. Thus there are people who are learned in the law who disagree with your position. Is it really hard for you to imagine that well educated, knowledgeable people can come to a different conclusion than you on what the 2nd amendment means? I’m claim neither to be well educated or knowledgeable. I do claim t…

> I’m claim neither to be well educated or knowledgeable. I do claim that when I read that amendment it seems to give the government broad powers of regulation over gun ownership.

I highly recommend that you either stop holding these ill-informed opinions by your own admission or stop prefixing your every post with the same disclaimer.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#614
post #587

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As the link you provided states, this decision applies to shopping centers in California, whose state supreme court has narrowed its applicability a few times over the years. This simply doesn't apply to YouTube.

It’s easier to argue that YouTube, Twitter, etc. are public forums. So it seems to me that the argument would be even stronger.

Probably not. There's a reason why the decision was so narrow - they explicitly didn't want to set a widely applicable precedent.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#615

There are _so_ many ways to make a leathel weapon I can't begin... If I take my car (a Jeep Grand Cherokee) and ram it into a crowd - I'm confident that can take out more people than I can with a gun, knife, probably even bomb. Point being, I understand not facilitating trade, but for the love of god, videos? You really want to push the right over the edge? We need guns. Legally, in the U.S. it's our right - one of t…

EDIT: The fact that I actually support the second amendment seems to be lost on some readers who didn't take the time to read a nuanced opinion. :) Okay, I don't support the restrictions YouTube and Reddit are putting on free speech, but I think we need to keep things rational here: > We need guns. Legally, in the U.S. it's our right - one of the first and most protected rights. The ability to defend yourself and cou…

> Look at the Branch Davidians in Waco, Texas. Whether or not you believe they had illegal guns, they had guns, and they died.

Sure, but if you think they were alive, do you think they would have looked back at what happened, they would have seen this as their failure or victory?

If Branch Dravidians didn't have guns, they would simply be arrested and forgotten in the history, whereas today they are folk heroes.

If anything, to all the gun rights supporters, Waco shows that fighting with guns works.

> Guns lose to tanks every time.

Then how do you explain US-Vietnam war, Second Iraq war, Afghanistan(first with USSR and then with US). The USSR's Afghanistan war is a great example, the only thing we supplied the Mujahiddins was guns.

Tanks only win centralized armies and we are very good with fighting centralized Armies (First Gulf war was a good example), however we SUCK at fighting decentralized forces. The only reason why we manage to defeat ISIS because ISIS got too centralized (and we got strong leadership), but keep in mind we have still not managed to win Iraq and a replacement of ISIS is in works.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#616
post #575

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Then perhaps dial back the anti-Apple rhetoric, or at least post something more substantial and thoughtful when you do. I don't have to be a mechanic to know when a car is broken, just like I don't have to know how all of Apple's software works to know that they don't actually value privacy. Please, prove me wrong. I'd love it if Apple actually put their money where their mouth is. Until then, I know enough about t…

When asking you to "post something more substantial and thoughtful when you do. You’ve seen enough responses from people to anticipate objections.", I'm asking you to do more than repeat "Apple pretends to care about privacy as long as it is good for the bottom line." to start out. From what I gather, your complaints with respect to Apple and privacy center around the source code not being open and you'd like them to…

I don't feel like anticipating arguments is very helpful, as much as it just adds noise. I could anticipate that someone will argue that because the sun is round, it proves that Apple can do no wrong, yet I don't bring that up, because until someone does, it seems to me to be a waste of time. In short, I am trying to be succinct rather than waste everyone's time arguing over something that nobody wants to argue about.

I don't view "Apple pretends to care about privacy as long as it is good for the bottom line" to be trolling, though I do admit I could phrase it better. Possibly "We don't know how much Apple cares about privacy, but they have taken a lot of actions that suspiciously point to them not caring about it more than they care about their bottom line. They also refuse to take actions that would prove to us that they do take privacy seriously.".

In trying to be succinct, it seems that I lost a lot of the important nuance, which I agree is important.

I would like to point to tech-giants that are pushing good security/privacy, but unfortunately, I don't know of any. I think the best I can point to might be Librem, but they don't have a functioning phone AFAIK.

> For a counterpoint, by controlling the marketplace, Apple has more control over quality and security, as well as the responsibility when something goes wrong. One can reasonably argue that they prefer this over letting anyone provide apps because they're concerned about malware being loaded, that other providers won't be paying as close attention.

I get this concern, but until they let go of that control, they are not enforcing reasonable privacy. It's a trade-off, and it's totally Apple's decision to make, but that means that they aren't doing "privacy right" if they choose the option that disregards privacy. Maybe that's better for their users, maybe not, but they have chosen the side that disregards privacy either way.

> On the other side, Apple doesn't have an business model where they make money from user data

That you know of. Unless you know something that I don't, you don't have access to see where all of their money is coming from. I agree it provides them a better incentive, but incentives don't mean anything.

I don't like comparing Apple to Google, because I find it irrelevant what Apple does. Google is an entirely different business. I dislike Google, and I believe that in many ways they are worse than Apple, but that's irrelevant to the discussion.

"Apple doesn't care about privacy as much as I want them to" doesn't accurately represent what my issue is. My issue is that the statement "At least Apple seems to care about privacy" is true, but the statement "Apple cares about privacy" is not true based on the decisions they make. They may care about it but their actions speak otherwise, and it doesn't matter what groups say, it matters what they do. Just because they "seem" to care about privacy doesn't mean that they do, and I don't want unaware users to support a company that, based on their actions, is likely lying to them.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#617
post #428

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The real reason for these new rules are the advertisers. The more objectionable content you have on your platform, the more difficult it becomes to attract them. Take 4chan as an example: For years they were struggling to find anyone who would want to advertise there, and that is not entirely surprising. Reddit is apparently also preparing an IPO in the foreseeable future. It would appear they are attempting to make…

I wonder how we can effectively punish Reddit for this. If we can cut into their advertising revenue and derail their IPO, that might force them to reverse their position.

You can stop using Reddit. That will drive down their advertising revenue.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#618

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I go by what the Constitution means. It’s meaning changes from person to person. And from era to era. I don’t feel bound to interpret it according to how the founders would interpret it. The second amendment means to me something different from what it means to you. As I’ve said all along In these threads, fight for your rights. Advocate for your position. I will fight to change public perception.

The point of the 13th amendment is to eliminate legal human trafficking once and for all. It's not reasonable to say that the meaning of that rule is allowed to change over time. And that standard has to apply for every part of the Constitution for the 13th amendment to have actual impact, otherwise it's just another holy text and can be ignored has a nice myth for simple people. But instead of people sinning by uncl…

You can't seriously believe that the words of constitution have the same meaning and interpretation for everyone. Clearly what people think the words mean changes from person to person and even from era to era. Peoples' views change over time. The words don't change but how people view and understand the meaning of those words change. This is not disputable or revelatory.

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#619

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want to block all connections to Apple, configure an always-on VPN to intercept all network traffic, then use a firewall to stop all Apple connections. If you want to minimize connections to Apple, don't use Apple apps or services. Wire replaces iMessage. 2doapp replaces Notes.

And if Apple wanted to prove that they actually care about privacy, they would design their apps in a way that I wouldn't have to connect to their servers in any way. This is true even when talking about their apps and services.

Can you recommend a vendor who meets these criteria?

Re: YouTube and Reddit roll out new restrictions including channel and sub bans

#620

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The second amendment states that a well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. I’m no expert on the legalities and legal interpretations of the 2nd amendment but it seems to me a case could be made that well regulated gives the government broad regulatory powers. The mention of militia could be interpreted to mean only members of the…

> The mention of militia could be interpreted to mean only members of the militia, clearly under the command of the military, can own guns. Rhode Island's 1842 constitution starts like this: > The liberty of the press being essential to the security of freedom in a state, any person may publish his sentiments on any subject, being responsible for the abuse of that liberty . . . . So according to you, if the 'security…

The basic answer is no. I was referring only to the 2nd Amendment of the United States Constitution. I have a view of what that amendment means and how it ought to be interpreted in the present era. I don't think I'd answer yes to your questions on interpreting the various texts you quoted.
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