Earlier quoted context omitted.
He didn't say it the fault of feminists, only that this was probably going to be the result. And It's exactly why public debate should be had. To come to a better solution in the middle, rather than create fringes on the sides. Your reaction here is just more of the 'Shock and Awe' and hurt feelings that doesn't really help push the agenda.
There can be no discussion when you start with a bad premise. What can you argue with someone that says the other sex is inferior?
Outraged about the Google diversity memo?
611–620 of 872 posts
Re: Outraged about the Google diversity memo?
#612Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Mad at someone for saying you're genetically predisposed to be less capable of individual action? He never said that. Could you cite the portion where he literally says women are less capable?
Do the last two bullet points of his tl;dr count?: * Differences in distributions of traits between men and women may in part explain why we don’t have 50% representation of women in tech and leadership. * Discrimination to reach equal representation is [...] bad for business. Which I read as, "woman aren't as good, that's why they don't already work here, if we hire more of them, they'll not be able to do the job as…
Being left-leaning, I've been doing a lot of looking into some of the ideas floating around amongst the right-leaning crowd since the election. Based upon that, I would say that yes, that is an unreasonable reading.
My understanding (subject to being completely off-base, of course) is that the argument is about biological differences related to interests and aspirations, not intelligence and capabilities. In other words, the early developmental stages cause differences in the brain among men and women that affect, in very general terms, what both may end up aspiring to in terms of career choices and hobbies/interests.
Women (again, speaking generally) could easily do any knowledge-based job performed by men, but you're going to have problems finding the numbers that you need if you want to hit a solid 50/50 distribution in certain types of fields. I think this is why certain fields have had very little trouble reaching either parity or female dominance after the women's equality movement started, while other fields struggle to this day. For example, I've read that SV has no problem with the distribution amongst the non-tech fields and that they slightly favor women, but in terms of engineering and tech, the distribution still lags by quite a bit. This would imply that SV is doing everything in its power to hire and promote women, and that there is something else going on that is the cause of what we're seeing. However, it could also imply that tech and engineering are all filled with men that are actively hostile to women to such a degree that women, even women extremely interested in such fields, simply avoid them. I suspect that, like all things in life, it's a mix of both.
Re: Outraged about the Google diversity memo?
#613I am sorry if I come across as a liberal who gets offended, but I completely support the decision of Google to fire him. In fact, I think that Google had no other choice than to fire him, and that's mostly because the engineer shot himself in the foot. Memos are not meant to express debatable personal arguments, memos are meant to express a company position. By widely spreading a personal view, the author impersonate…
No, it was shared outside of his control to a wider audience from the initial recipients, then to the press by an anonymous source, who then culled references, notes, and charts from the document which were important points.
The publicity was distinctly out of his control, and I think that publicity had a major part in his firing (if it didn't, Google should also be firing the people who agree with him and participated in discussions with him)
Re: Outraged about the Google diversity memo?
#614Earlier quoted context omitted.
> You cannot reduce the "gap" by aiming at the women who are already at Google. This should be obvious. They are already there. To make a dent in the gap, you need to attract more women who currently do not choose to work in tech or not at Google. So nothing he writes is about his colleagues at Google, or by extension women who are already in or interested in tech. It is about potentially attracting those who are not…
> current hiring policies And he made it clear that he didn't think they were producing "false positives", so every woman hired was qualified. > There are so many potential sources of preference Yes. Biology is one . > gender stereotypes http://www.spsp.org/blog/stereotype-accuracy-response [Stereotype Accuracy Is One Of The Largest And Most Replicable Effects In All Of Social Psychology] > [verbal/math scores correl…
Re: Outraged about the Google diversity memo?
#615Re: Outraged about the Google diversity memo?
#616Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why? What positive connotation could be drawn from it?
the context of that suggestion was to make the activity more appealing in order to entice more candidates, not to compensate for a skill deficiency. My interpretation of this point should not be taken as an endorsement of it or the document as a whole
I was hoping not to discuss the document as a whole myself. I largely avoided the last pseudoscientific cesspool of a thread.
Re: Outraged about the Google diversity memo?
#617Earlier quoted context omitted.
Can you indulge me in a thought experiment. You seem like a reasonable human being but I think your question shows that you may have fallen into a moral trap. Can you explain to me the point I've made that you're arguing for or against with your question. Show me how your question has any impact on that point. If you're taking a side and saying "But did you know this person was literally Hitler" then you may have fal…
> Can you explain to me the point I've made that you're arguing for or against with your question. The idea in your comment is that you can't, or at least are dissuaded, to express certain opinions. Most the things I hear about Google, including the existence of a list talking about the harms of political correctness, that the author felt free to write such a report and many other reported freedoms at work indicate t…
Re: Outraged about the Google diversity memo?
#618Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Twitter seems to be a poor vehicle for nuanced debate at the best of time Understatement of the century. How on earth can you expect to have "nuanced debate" with only 140 characters?
> How on earth can you expect to have "nuanced debate" with only 140 characters? Oh come now, it seems to work fine for Trump! /s
Re: Outraged about the Google diversity memo?
#619Earlier quoted context omitted.
Where? How? In what words?
Implication means not explicit. Thus it's up to your interpretation. The context also can affect the implications, including the author's actions after the publication (his interviews on YouTube).
Re: Outraged about the Google diversity memo?
#620Earlier quoted context omitted.
I made the grave mistake of trying to express that point on Twitter. Twitter seems to be a poor vehicle for nuanced debate at the best of time, but it's a dumpster fire right now full of raging people who don't understand what you've just said. I was in SV last year for a couple of months during the election, and everyone I met were all paid up members of the church of political correctness up front, but when you spo…
> I was in SV last year for a couple of months during the election, and everyone I met were all paid up members of the church of political correctness up front, but when you spoke to these people in private there were a lot of people who were secretly conservative, but "It's Silicon Valley and you can't be a Republican out here". I guess they did not consider the voting booth to be private, as SV is one of the areas…
As long as there's food and shelter for most, things will continue as they are. First little bit of suffering, and it will explode into revolution. Normal way of things.