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It's hard to justify buying a Framework 12

jeffgeerling.com

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Re: It's hard to justify buying a Framework 12

#601

Post by close04 »

jnovek wrote: post #559
andybp85 wrote: post #538

Earlier quoted context omitted.

in my day job doing enterprise web apps at a mac shop 16G became unusable for the engineers 3-5 yeas ago. i managed to weasel into them getting me a 64G M1 Pro in 2022 (now they won't buy us any higher than 32G). i'll probably still be using this thing in six years! to be fair, given the choice between a decade-old macbook and basically any current windows box with same specs, i'd take the macbook every time. but, if…

What web stuff are you guys working on that 16GB didn’t cut it a few years ago? I’m not questioning your statement, it’s just completely different world from my day-to-day and I’m curious.

Probably building web stuff. This is how you end up with software that needs buckets of RAM. Because the dev never felt the pain. The classic “works on my machine”. Every dev I know works on the beefiest machines they can get their hands on.

Re: It's hard to justify buying a Framework 12

#602

Post by culopatin »

ece wrote: post #600
culopatin wrote: post #595

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of the 6 MacBooks that have circled through my house since 2018 I’ve had to do repairs on 0 of them. 5 are still active

Let me guess, no upgrades either.

Didnt really need any. I’m still using my M1 Pro from when it was released. My mom using the oldest Air now.

Re: It's hard to justify buying a Framework 12

#603

Post by musicale »

swiftcoder wrote: post #573
jnovek wrote: post #559

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What web stuff are you guys working on that 16GB didn’t cut it a few years ago? I’m not questioning your statement, it’s just completely different world from my day-to-day and I’m curious.

In my case, the corporate MDM solution consumed so much resources that a 16GB MacBook was basically unusable for dev work (my personal Mac, also with 16GB in those days, was fine)

Likely third-party "security" software.

I can't believe CrowdStrike still exists after they vaporized billions of customer dollars and stranded people for days.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2024_CrowdStrike-related_IT_ou...

Re: It's hard to justify buying a Framework 12

#604

Post by benoau »

al_borland wrote: post #469
simondotau wrote: post #412

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> USB-C-only laptops I think it's hilarious that Apple managed to get criticised for being both too early AND too late with USB-C.

To be fair, they were criticized a lot for dropping the 30-pin connector and going to Lightning too. At the time they said they designed Lightning to last 10 years (about how long 30-pin lasted), because they knew how disruptive a port change is with all the accessories people have. It lasted from 2012-2023, 11 years. So they made good on their promise.

"Promise" is doing a lot of heavy lifting, this whole theory is extrapolated entirely from a single remark during the iPhone 5 introduction in 2012, "this connector is a modern connector for the next decade".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V4gC4Z-fx5k&t=1571s

The only other time they referred to replacing Lightning was when Joswiak said "obviously we’ll have to comply, we have no choice.".

https://www.theverge.com/2022/10/26/23423977/iphone-usb-c-eu...

Re: It's hard to justify buying a Framework 12

#605

Post by benoau »

tonyedgecombe wrote: post #449
benoau wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a counter-point, look at WINE on Linux and Crostini's containerized software on ChromeOS, clearly it is possible to support varied software without over-complicating the OS. And that's what Rosetta 2 does as well, if it's held Apple back the last 6 years it hasn't shown at all. It will be very surprising if we see any benefits from cutting Rosetta 2, especially worth gutting all the games and software this has emp…

At this point cutting Rossetta 2 is probably to force the laggards like Sonos to start supporting Apple Silicon.

I just don't see how that's worth cutting off the ability to run Windows versions of Steam and games and software through Crossover and WINE. So much more software is being affected than just Mac apps that haven't been updated, yet transparently run just fine.

If Valve shut down Proton to force developers to release Linux versions of their games for the Steam Deck it would be unequivocally bad, right?

Re: It's hard to justify buying a Framework 12

#606

Post by nozzlegear »

bigyabai wrote: post #570
nozzlegear wrote: post #393

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No I don't think it's disingenuous – indeed, it seemed to me that you were being disingenuous. My actual argument is that you're confusing Netflix's use of DRM for "Apple's implementation," without acknowledging that you'd have this exact same problem on Windows and Android devices. That Linux doesn't have it is just testament to the fact that hardly anyone, comparatively speaking, actually uses Linux as a daily driv…

No DRM on my machine. You must be holding it wrong?

I'm not interested in dragging my eyelids over whatever esoteric setup notorious Apple shittalker bigyabai uses to feel haughty when dispensing cherry-picked bullshit on HN. Move on.

Re: It's hard to justify buying a Framework 12

#607

Post by mbreese »

p2detar wrote: post #596
swiftcoder wrote: post #573

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my case, the corporate MDM solution consumed so much resources that a 16GB MacBook was basically unusable for dev work (my personal Mac, also with 16GB in those days, was fine)

I find it hard to believe that it was due to the MDM? The Apple MDM protocol is embedded in MacOS. Were you using some sort of agent software?

(Many) Windows admins have no idea what to do with Macs. It’s very easy for overzealous agent antivirus and firewall software to suck up CPU resources. Particularly when it is written by a company with no idea how to write Mac software, bought and installed by admins that don’t use Macs.

I had one set of “enterprise” software destroy the battery in my work Mac because of how it worked (and crashed). Meanwhile, my personal Mac was completely fine. Apple moving MDM related security software out of the kernel was the best thing they could have done for stability.

Re: It's hard to justify buying a Framework 12

#608

Post by bigyabai »

nozzlegear wrote: post #606
bigyabai wrote: post #570

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No DRM on my machine. You must be holding it wrong?

I'm not interested in dragging my eyelids over whatever esoteric setup notorious Apple shittalker bigyabai uses to feel haughty when dispensing cherry-picked bullshit on HN. Move on.

That must suck. I have no reservations challenging unqualified ideologues over their selfish platitudes, you should try it sometime.

Have fun defending DRM requirements, and thank you for subsidizing my 4k Netflix torrents!

Re: It's hard to justify buying a Framework 12

#609

Post by ece »

culopatin wrote: post #602
ece wrote: post #600

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me guess, no upgrades either.

Didnt really need any. I’m still using my M1 Pro from when it was released. My mom using the oldest Air now.

I've upgraded my desktops more with GPUs and power supplies accordingly, but old laptop SSDs make fine backup enclosure drives (no I haven't seen them lose data when unplugged) and upgrading RAM for larger models on a AMD Zen 2 laptop worked pretty great for me. None of these were needed, they were just nice to be able to do mostly before the higher RAM prices started.

Re: It's hard to justify buying a Framework 12

#610

Post by kbolino »

shantara wrote: post #525
rangestransform wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Forcing developers off of Rosetta 2 is a pro-consumer move because it gives the ultimate incentive for developers to modernize. I don’t want to use Lightroom (replace with whatever app is part of your workflow) through x86 emulation, I want Apple to bitch slap Adobe into porting it to native. Microsoft will be forced to expend resources to support x86 emulation for all of eternity. Apple throwing their weight around…

Apple dropping 32-bit support resulted in me losing access to 3/4 of my Mac Steam library. Not every piece of software is built with an endless update treadmill in mind, no matter how much Apple would like to force the developers into one with their breaking changes and developer program subscription. This would result in people losing access to a bunch of software just so Apple could shrug and shift the blame elsewh…

The entire existence of 32-bit x86 Macs is in and of itself a tragedy of Apple's own making. Intel shipped the Core 2, a 64-bit CPU widely regarded as one of the company's greatest products, later in the very same year that Apple shipped the first x86 Macs. There was never any reason for 32-bit x86 Macs to exist except for Apple's rush to get them out the door and close down the AIM alliance.
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