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Keep Android Open

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Re: Keep Android Open

#601

Post by nananana9 »

wepple wrote: post #592
direwolf20 wrote: post #565

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's ban passwords because you could give me your password

Hilarious example to use, because that literally is an effort that’s underway. Thousands of people get scammed and have their lives ruined every year, so deprecating passwords is absolutely the right move

Yeah, no. The actual solution is

1. Stop requiring computers/phones for everything. Your 91 year old grandma isn't going to make her way through your super cool very intuitive 2FA magic link email confirmation system, and I don't WANT to make my way through your super cool very intuitive 2FA magic link email confirmation system.

2. teach the people who need to use computers, how to use them.

Re: Keep Android Open

#603

Post by severino »

jaza wrote: post #414
ipdashc wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> banking/insurance/whatever apps I know banking apps are the typical example, but I've always wondered why. I use my bank's app maybe once or twice a year when I need to Zelle someone, which I only need to do when they don't have Venmo. (Unless we consider Venmo a banking app.) I only have one bank's app installed, the rest of my banks I only interact with over their website, on desktop. As for insurance, I've never…

My main bank is Commonwealth aka CBA (one of the "big 4" banks here in Australia). For a long time, I held out against installing their mobile app (on Android), and managed fine with their web UI (and with 2FA codes via SMS). Then, 2 or 3 years ago, I needed to start using PayID (sort-of Australia's version of Venmo, ie free instant transfers, except it's supported directly by all the major banks here). And I discove…

So, leaving aside the discussion about whether someone wants to use their bank's application or not, what's the bank response if their application just doesn't work in your phone? That you must purchase a new phone or be locked out of using your account?

I hope, now that the debate about our excessive reliance on American tech is on the table, that we also put limits on those essential services, like banks, imposing the usage of products from only two companies (Google or Apple) in order to operate. I think that goes at least against the spirit of the European Union.

Re: Keep Android Open

#604

Post by severino »

econ wrote: post #492
cwillu wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It won't though, because there's a ecosystem of banking/insurance/whatever apps that have bought into the android/iphone lockdown mindsete that people will simply be locked out of. Open alternatives can grow when there is a viable means of slow growth, and cutting off the oxygen to such things is the implicit intent.

The Wero payment system will cover the entire EU but apparently doesn't have a web portal the way ideal has. Soon we Europians will only be able to pay using either an iphone or an Android device. Hilarious

They will say: hey, now you're free from Visa and Mastercard for your payments! (only to be forced into the Google/Apple duopoly, which is far worse).

Re: Keep Android Open

#606

Post by redbell »

tadfisher wrote: post #7

Just to put out what Google actually said in their blog post [0]: > We appreciate the community's engagement and have heard the early feedback – specifically from students and hobbyists who need an accessible path to learn, and from power users who are more comfortable with security risks. We are making changes to address the needs of both groups. > We heard from developers who were concerned about the barrier to ent…

For reference, [0] was discussed here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45908938

Re: Keep Android Open

#607

Post by 1vuio0pswjnm7 »

JoshTriplett wrote: post #454
kelvinjps10 wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Those things that you mentioned you can do it on the website meaning also a open computer too

> Those things that you mentioned you can do it on the website No, unfortunately some things can't be. There are venues that provide tickets exclusively via mobile applications, for instance.

"There are venues that provide tickets exclusively via mobile applications, for instance."

Turns out Ticketmaster still has ticket printing machines at such venues

Was at a game at one of them, claimed I had a problem with the app and after some negotiation at the ticket window a millennial printed me a ticket

Why do they still have the printers

The "I'm having a problem with the app" strategy can work in other contexts too. The phone can be configured so that a young person trying to help gives up

"Modern" software is highly fallible and everyone knows it

Re: Keep Android Open

#608

Post by magpi3 »

gf000 wrote: post #557
beeflet wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The limitation of linux phones is hardware. I have been watching the progress of postmarketOS on the fairphone 4, and looks promising.

No, gnu/Linux is nowhere near usable as a daily driver mobile device for 99% of the population. Besides having terrible battery life and security, it's just a hobby thing. Android has had millions of dev hours poured into it to be what it is.

In the 90s, you would have said the exact same thing about linux on the PC.

Free software ultimately has time on its side. As long as a project has enough mindshare to keep its momentum, it really is unstoppable in the long run.

Re: Keep Android Open

#609

Post by severino »

shakna wrote: post #406
danny_codes wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve found the mobile websites for a lot of these cases to be fine. Not a great UX but not a blocker

And if your bank only does 2FA via app?

Complain. Mine wanted that, but after complaining they offered me SMS. If not, I'd have closed my account there. At least here in Spain there are plenty of banks that don't force you to use apps. I also leave bad ratings for banking apps from time to time, and bad comments on X.

Re: Keep Android Open

#610

Post by kllrnohj »

microtonal wrote: post #533
kllrnohj wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"flashing" a phone is largely the same as any OTA update. There's of course always a risk of it going wrong, disk failures are always possible, but it's exceptionally hard to do so accidentally. Especially with custom ROMs where they basically never include a new bootloader, so "flashing" is no different than installing an OS on a desktop system - it's just writing to the boot partition. Which you can always do again…

It is not 'largely the same as OTA' on phones with downgrade protection. Once you lock the device again, it's game over because the bootloader refuses to boot an older version of the OS, and you cannot unlock the phone anymore. Happens all the time in the /e/OS and Fairphone forums. It really depends on the device. E.g. Pixel is quite hard to brick. Though they do sometimes increment the anti-rollback version: https:…

It is still largely the same, those downgrade protections apply to OTAs as well. Those anti-rollback don't brick the device, either. It might not boot to a working OS, but you can still get back to the bootloader to flash something newer. Unless you blindly lock the bootloader without testing if it boots first and the bootloader can't be unlocked again I guess, but that's quite a sequence of bad choices all around
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