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France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

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Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#601

Post by PaulDavisThe1st »

irishcoffee wrote: post #581
PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kamala Harris/Tim Walz 75,019,230 48.34% Donald J. Trump/J.D. Vance 77,303,568 49.81% Various Others 2,878,359 1.85% So, 50.19% voted against Trump, 49.81% voted for him.

Voting for a 3rd candidate isn't a vote against one of the other two, or does your logic work both ways? so 51.66% of people voted against Harris? You know what, I don't even care if you respond. The election is over, and we can twist these numbers until the next election. The logical leaps taken about voting for/against someone are troubling. The tropes around this are disturbing. The emotional vitriol around all of…

There is no question that he won the presidential election in 2024.

However, when people say things like "this is what Americans voted for" ... there's a bit more nuance required. His election win is what our electoral process produced. But to conclude from that that an actual majority of Americans preferred his policies to anyone else's ... that's a mistake.

And yes, 51.66% of people voted against Harris - they could have voted for her, but chose to vote for someone else.

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#602

Post by irishcoffee »

rootusrootus wrote: post #589
irishcoffee wrote: post #581

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Voting for a 3rd candidate isn't a vote against one of the other two, or does your logic work both ways? so 51.66% of people voted against Harris? You know what, I don't even care if you respond. The election is over, and we can twist these numbers until the next election. The logical leaps taken about voting for/against someone are troubling. The tropes around this are disturbing. The emotional vitriol around all of…

> The logical leaps taken about voting for/against someone are troubling. The tropes around this are disturbing. The emotional vitriol around all of those are even worse. Alright, the next step is to accuse everyone who might try to ground the discussion in truth that they must have TDS. I am not a huge fan of accusing one's opponents of projection, but man, sometimes it really does seem to be the most plausible answ…

> Alright, the next step is to accuse everyone who might try to ground the discussion in truth that they must have TDS. I am not a huge fan of accusing one's opponents of projection, but man, sometimes it really does seem to be the most plausible answer.

Ground the discussion in which truth?

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#603

Post by irishcoffee »

alephnerd wrote: post #468
irishcoffee wrote: post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean… respond to my comment and I’ll click those links and do the homework to give a thoughtful response to yours…?

I responded to your comment. If you cannot read between the lines that's on you.

> I responded to your comment. If you cannot read between the lines that's on you.

It isn't on me to infer your thought processes. How strange.

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#604

Post by pembrook »

bborud wrote: post #582
pembrook wrote: post #546

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EU inc is worthless without alignment on a single capital market for fundraising and ultimately going public, sane/interoperable labor laws for hiring, and a single language market over the long term. The last piece is extremely important. Being able to raise money and hire across the EU with no friction would be fantastic, but it means nothing if actually selling into different EU markets has massive language barrie…

Political tidal forces in Europe have, for quite some time, pointed more toward fragmentation than toward strengthening common structures. What makes this particularly ironic is that this impulse is often strongest among the same voices that most loudly lament Europe’s failure to build globally competitive industries—software foremost among them. That tension has always struck me as deeply paradoxical. In the post-Br…

Definitely agree, this is the classic left/right contradiction that has always existed.

In the past, center-left and center-right coalitions were able to find win-win compromises out of this contradiction. But now that everyone has moved outward on the political spectrum and gone populist on both sides, it's a stalemate.

The pro-central planning folks are now anti-business and anti-growth since private capital represents a threat to their utopian authoritarian dreams (this truth will be masked with religious appeals to the poor and the environment of course).

The pro-business, pro-growth folks are conversely anti-central planning, since government represents a threat to their utopian libertarian dreams (central planners might kill the unfair arbitrage opportunities they've found, and central planners tend to overspend and expect the private sector to pay for it).

While central planners are terrible capital allocators, strong central planning is the only way to create well functioning markets. For example, the US Federal government wields total control over US state governments in basically everything.

What Europe needs is a center coalition of pro-business and pro-government wonks (basically what the neocons were), but the phrase 'neocon' has become a bizarre internet meme for conspiracy theorists and there exists very little interest in moderate viewpoints these days.

I'm guessing we'll all be dead before any of these issues are solved in Europe (if ever), absent a full-scale Russian or Chinese invasion forcing the EU to integrate.

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#605

Post by jacquesm »

quadrifoliate wrote: post #131
antirez wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not true. For instance in the field of video pipelines ffmpeg is the standard, and was started by an European (French) person. Runs on Linux of course, that ..., and so forth. Do you really believe in Europe there is no the tech capability to recreate the tech stack? This is an extremely naive way to put it. US tech is much more developed because of money infusion even on companies that take 10/20 years to get…

> This is an extremely naive way to put it. US tech is much more developed because of money infusion even on companies that take 10/20 years to get productive. Not sure if this is aimed at the immediate parent comment or mine, but I agree completely. US tech is developed due to the unique VC ecosystem, but in my opinion EU governments have lagged behind on setting up their own ecosystem (VC or otherwise) that would c…

It's not for lack of trying but once such a massive attractor exists repeating the process is not necessarily possible because any local success can be bought out and then you have to start from zero again. The EU would have to instigate some strong protectionist measures and that's not its style, though it may well become a necessity.

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#606

Post by jesterson »

croon wrote: post #534
jesterson wrote: post #472

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> in fact they are just protecting their citizens' rights against unethical business models regardless of origin Would you elaborate how this "in fact" is "protecting their citizens' rights"? Very curious to know.

https://apnews.com/article/icc-trump-sanctions-karim-khan-co... > Microsoft, for example, cancelled Khan’s email address, forcing the prosecutor to move to Proton Mail, a Swiss email provider, ICC staffers said. His bank accounts in his home country of the U.K. have been blocked.

I fail to see how that addresses my question

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#607

Post by muyuu »

cortesoft wrote: post #600
muyuu wrote: post #576

Earlier quoted context omitted.

tbh I was always of the mind that Github offers nothing over some slight convenience in hosting and some exposure, in exchange for the loss of control Github had enough mindshare that for a small dev operation it was a form of social networking on top of actual code revision control, and one could get the occasional PR worth looking at; this consideration has essentially gone away as the amount of unreviewed vibecode…

What control do you lose with github that you want to maintain? For any code you are sharing, I think you are underselling the hosting + sharing convenience. Everyone looks for projects on github, it is what people expect. Hosting it yourself requires managing user signups/accounts/permissions/etc.

Well, if you're using it like it's supposed to be used, all of it is accessible by a third party and its availability depends on them. It will all be potentially scrapped (meaning it will be). You are essentially outsourcing the hosting as well, with its pros and cons. I'm heavily biased against that, so it's not only a github thing but a "cloud computing culture" thing. I only use other people's computer when using my own is a real problem or it's just not feasible.

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#608

Post by stefs »

Ylpertnodi wrote: post #183
badc0ffee wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

70 million Americans voted for him. His biggest demographic win compared to the last election was non-white men. Immediately dismissing this as racism isn't going to help you understand it, or help the Democrats beat the Republicans.

The dems are just as corrupt, just wiith a nicer smile. Eu citizen, here - all politicians are bent. Anecdata: Anyone who votes for a politician should stfu, stop complaining and live with it. Why should i suffer alone? Disenfranchised? Not me - idgaf. I just hope the eu gets its act together and actually does something, but it will be difficult; language alone, being one of them, and "my pie", another.

> The dems are just as corrupt

that's just simply not true and arguing like this publicily increases acceptance of corruption.

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#609

Post by bratwurst3000 »

jesterson wrote: post #606
croon wrote: post #534

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://apnews.com/article/icc-trump-sanctions-karim-khan-co... > Microsoft, for example, cancelled Khan’s email address, forcing the prosecutor to move to Proton Mail, a Swiss email provider, ICC staffers said. His bank accounts in his home country of the U.K. have been blocked.

I fail to see how that addresses my question

for example EU privacy laws can be ignored in the states with for example the cloud act. having control over software and infrastructure is protecting the rights of eu citizen in that regard.

Re: France dumps Zoom and Teams as Europe seeks digital autonomy from the US

#610

Post by bratwurst3000 »

sofixa wrote: post #577
RamblingCTO wrote: post #572

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you saying only French companies build defense stuff in France or it's the only country in Europe that builds defense stuff in general? Germany has quite a lot of defense companies that supply half the world I think.

They are saying that France is the only country that builds its own defence stuff only in country (unlike Germany that would buy American jets, for instance). And it's true for most things that matter. The only exception I can think of is manufactured by cooperative companies that are part owned by France and have facilities in France but that specific thing might be made somewhere else (e.g. Airbus A400Ms for which…

airbus is owned by germany and france to each 10% and spain 4%. Things get interesting if you count all the owners from the states together they have ≈ 12%. But it is controlled by Germany france spain.
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