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AI generated music barred from Bandcamp

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Re: AI generated music barred from Bandcamp

#601

Post by entuno »

maomaomiumiu wrote: post #555

I think the real issue isn’t AI music itself, but transparency and incentives. If people know what they’re listening to and how it was made, they can decide for themselves. Problems start when AI-generated tracks are mixed into recommendations without clear labeling or context. A good song can still be a good song — but trust in the platform matters.

Does this same argument not apply to other areas of music though? By that line of reasoning, should sites not also have to declare whether they used synthesisers rather than real instruments, or autotune for vocals, or all kinds of other things like that so that the listeners can make informed decisions?

Re: AI generated music barred from Bandcamp

#602

Post by The_President »

blibble wrote: post #458
JohnFen wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> all about the DAC, no? Yes, it is (unless the CD player is so bad that it can't do adequate error correction). What I do is rip the CD to my music server, which is where I listen to the music from. Then the quality of the CD player isn't important, as long as it works correctly.

it's surprising difficult to rip from audio CDs in a error free manner most tools do it badly and just accept what the drive gives them in default mode, often with glitches

I archive CDs continuously with a workhorse of an external unit from 2010 and it converts a full album audio disc to 320kbps VBR MP3 in like ten minutes.

Only issues come from damaged retail discs and dead burned ones.

Re: AI generated music barred from Bandcamp

#603

Post by eagleal »

lukevp wrote: post #225
drittich wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also a musician and I don't think it's that amusing. IMO this isn't an "AI can't be art" discussion. It's about the fact that AI can be used to extract value from other artists' work without consent, and then out-compete them on volume by flooding the marketplace.

And you create music without ever having heard music before? Or are you also extracting other artist’s work and using it as inspiration for what you do? AI music is the same as AI code. It’s derived from real code, but it’s not just regurgitated wholesale. You still as a person with taste have to guide it and provide inputs. Electronic music made it so you didn’t have to learn to play an instrument. Auto tune made it…

> And you create music without ever having heard music before? Or are you also extracting other artist’s work and using it as inspiration for what you do?

The volumes of production are really scales of magnitude of difference between a human producing music, and a computer.

With a script and generator 1 individual could oversaturate the whole marketplace overnight rendering it impossible for other individuals to be found let alone extract any value.

Also, I don't know if you've ever done music production for fun but you don't really just setup only a prompt. It takes a significant amount of time to actually produce something. Time setting up a DAW system and export an empty track, and submitting it. An empty track.

Let alone actually doing all the microoptimizations by ear and trial to produce any catchy tune. Meanwhile a statistical approach doesn't even have to understand what's it's doing, could as well be white noise for all it matters.

Re: AI generated music barred from Bandcamp

#604

Post by dragandj »

drittich wrote: post #112
BrokrnAlgorithm wrote: post #79

I'm a musician, but am also pretty amused by this anti ai wave. There was recently a post referencing aphex twin and old school idm and electronic music stuff and i can't help bein reminded how every new tech kit got always demonized until some group of artists came along and made it there own. Even if its just creative prompting, or perhaps custom trained models, someday someone will come along and make a genuine ar…

Also a musician and I don't think it's that amusing. IMO this isn't an "AI can't be art" discussion. It's about the fact that AI can be used to extract value from other artists' work without consent, and then out-compete them on volume by flooding the marketplace.

IMHO, it would be solved by just making AI "art" un-copyrightable. Fine, make "AI art" as much as you wish. Sell and buy it as much as you please if you find it to your taste. BUT, you can NOT participate in organizations that take royalties from radio stations, TVs, movies, records, etc. for publishing, performance, etc.

Re: AI generated music barred from Bandcamp

#605

Post by dragandj »

Krasnol wrote: post #539
JohnFen wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Electronic music made it so you didn’t have to learn to play an instrument. Auto tune made it so you didn’t have to learn how to sing on key. Neither of those things are really true, though. They made it possible to make poor music without learning those things, I suppose, but not make good music. > Banning the new types of art Nobody is seriously talking about banning AI generated music. What you're seeing is a pl…

What is "good" music?

Perhaps music that at least the author would listen to? To this day I haven't heard an AI song that made me wish I press the rewind/play to listen it again. Granted, most human-generated songs are crap, too, but at least they are not crap to their authors.

Re: AI generated music barred from Bandcamp

#606

Post by gambiting »

leptons wrote: post #439
gambiting wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's music and there's music. When I want to listen to Music then I pick an artist and album manually. But 99% of the time, I just need something to play in the background when I'm working or cooking or cleaning - then it just has to sound pleasant, the value of that for me is exactly zero. Some of the best mixes I find for that are ai generated because they have a uniform pleasant sound for a long time, without a…

The sterility of AI generated music will lead to a sterility in creativity of humans if "AI" generated music ever becomes dominant. The world is messy, and human music reflects that. But good for you if your life is so uncomplicated that human-created music seems offensive to you, I guess?

Well let me ask you this - if you want to listen to sounds of the rain in a forest or waves crashing on the beach as you fall asleep(as many people do), do you care if someone actually sat on a beach with a microphone for 4 hours straight, or is it ok if what is effectively white noise is computer generated?

It's the same with background music when I work. But like as a specific example, that's a specific track I quite listening to, and it's 100% AI generated. Can you really say it doesn't have any character?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJUvNVCqtpI

>> The world is messy, and human music reflects that

Are you familiar with the term "elevator music"? It doesn't need to be messy or have any character to it - it just has to cover the noises of the elevator moving up and down its shaft.

>>d that human-created music seems offensive to you,

I literally never said that, please stop implying so.

Re: AI generated music barred from Bandcamp

#607

Post by lotsofpulp »

_DeadFred_ wrote: post #448
marknutter wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you came across a song and fell in love with it, only to find out later that it was generated by ai, would you stop loving the song?

If the players played really well, would you follow an AI generated basketball league?

Maybe, it’s seems like a low bar to be more interesting than the current version of NBA or NCAA.

Re: AI generated music barred from Bandcamp

#608

Post by CJefferson »

lukevp wrote: post #225
drittich wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also a musician and I don't think it's that amusing. IMO this isn't an "AI can't be art" discussion. It's about the fact that AI can be used to extract value from other artists' work without consent, and then out-compete them on volume by flooding the marketplace.

And you create music without ever having heard music before? Or are you also extracting other artist’s work and using it as inspiration for what you do? AI music is the same as AI code. It’s derived from real code, but it’s not just regurgitated wholesale. You still as a person with taste have to guide it and provide inputs. Electronic music made it so you didn’t have to learn to play an instrument. Auto tune made it…

Actually, to me this is the perfect argument to make AI music not have copyright.

Normally the copyright is owned by the creator. Algorithms can't own copyrights, so there is no copyright. There is already legal history on this.

Re: AI generated music barred from Bandcamp

#609

Post by djeastm »

entuno wrote: post #601
maomaomiumiu wrote: post #555

I think the real issue isn’t AI music itself, but transparency and incentives. If people know what they’re listening to and how it was made, they can decide for themselves. Problems start when AI-generated tracks are mixed into recommendations without clear labeling or context. A good song can still be a good song — but trust in the platform matters.

Does this same argument not apply to other areas of music though? By that line of reasoning, should sites not also have to declare whether they used synthesisers rather than real instruments, or autotune for vocals, or all kinds of other things like that so that the listeners can make informed decisions?

I don't think any consumer would object to that. Typically the instrument thing is already handled in the "liner notes" (or the digital equivalent). It'd be nice to see a disclaimer for auto-tune as well.

Re: AI generated music barred from Bandcamp

#610

Post by SethMurphy »

olivierestsage wrote: post #16

Funny to see this right now. Spotify's promotion of AI music bothered me so much that it has actually pushed me to Bandcamp and the practice of buying music again. It's really fun to build a collection knowing you're supporting the artists, download FLAC files, organize your little "collection" page ... Feels like a renaissance in my relationship with music, the most fun I've had since what.cd. Anyway, love this stan…

It took one obvious, obnoxious, and well infiltrated new music AI slop in the my recommended new music feed to finally turn me completely sour on Spotify. I was a prelaunch US user who had brand loyalty built in from the start. I even met Daniel Ek during the big early hype. Its gone. It has been the listen of last resort for awhile, and I used it for discovery of new releases. It's dead to me now
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