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I want an iPhone Mini-sized Android phone (2022)

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Re: I want an iPhone Mini-sized Android phone (2022)

#601
post #562

What I find fascinating is that Apple's and [Android manufacturers]'s previous attempts at smaller phones aren't even worth maintaining after they assess sales. In my mind, these companies are all so massive they can afford a little fragmentation for the obviously small market, with no meaningful impact to their sales numbers or profits. On the iPhone minis, there's very obviously a market for them, but the market is…

> Is it really that expensive to maintain a more niche line for each generation? Think of just the work that goes into having an assembly line customized for a specific form factor. To keep price, quality, and profit in line with their other phones I think the answer here is clearly yes.

Especially if having that line means only 1% more customers and 19% customers that just buy the small model instead of the other model. And unless you are launching the Mini Pro Max Ultra X you are losing money on that 9% of customers that would have bought the higher margin phone but instead bought the mini version which is only available at the more base model.

(Numbers made up to illustrate the point)

Re: I want an iPhone Mini-sized Android phone (2022)

#602
post #563

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who decides what a normal-sized device is?

Screen manufacturers, based on orders from the big buyers. They set up their machines to build panels and cut them to size, minimizing wasted area. If you want one of the sizes built in volume, great; if not, it's very difficult.

There's a nice anecdote from ~2019:

Within one year, the screen size of nearly all mass-market smartphones took a huge bump from 5.x" to 6.5", because of two ODMs (device manufacturers who are contracted by big brands to design and produce smartphones). Those two ODMs won contracts to produce mass-market devices for the brands Lenovo/Motorola, Huawei and Xiaomi based on a 6.5" 720p LCD.

The total volume forecast was so big, that suddenly 6.5" displays were cheaper than any other 720p smartphone panel. Other Smartphone brands adjusted mid-development because the larger panel also made the PCBs and batteries cheaper. In that year, mass-market devices with 1080p displays were often smaller (which was contradictory for a vendor-portfolio until then) because there was no such economics of scale on higher-resolution panels.

So within a single year, displays got a full inch larger, not because the consumer demanded it but because of supply-chain dynamics.

Re: I want an iPhone Mini-sized Android phone (2022)

#603
post #598
post #538

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unihertz devices fill a gap but are subpar phones in terms of hardware. They also don't get any software updates the minute after they are launched.

>They also don't get any software updates the minute after they are launched. If you install Lineage or something, isn't that essentially a non-issue? Otherwise those seem great! Never heard of them.

No official LineageOS support according to https://wiki.lineageos.org/devices/. And no, missing vendor support is still an issue even with Lineage support, as soon as firmware (and sometimes driver) updates are needed.

Re: I want an iPhone Mini-sized Android phone (2022)

#604

The hard reality is that there is no PAYING market for such a device, because when it comes to the point-of-sale, most people still choose the normal-size device with better screen/battery/camera. This is equivalent to something I called the "QWERTY paradox" more than a decade ago: Back when the Smartphone market exploded, people disliked typing on a touchscreen and repeatedly stated that they want a device with a ph…

Eric is now using the Lightphone 3, and apparently he loves it: https://www.thelightphone.com/lightiii

Although, it's not exactly what he wished for in 2022 since it doesn't run standard Android and obviously doesn't have industrial design like the iPhone mini.

Re: I want an iPhone Mini-sized Android phone (2022)

#606
post #460

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When asking people if they'd buy a yellow Sony Walkman people said yes. Shortly after given the choice to take one home the same people picked black. https://medium.com/@diogomarta/the-yellow-walkman-paradox-th...

A bunny walks into a bakery. There he asks the baker if he has any carrot cake. The bakers says: ‘No, I don’t sell carrot cake.’ So the bunny leaves, but returns the next day. He once again asks if the baker has any carrot cake. Once more the baker answers: ‘No, I don’t sell carrot cake.’ Once the bunny left, the baker started making a carrot cake thinking the bunny would return the next day for the cake. And so the…

I love carrot cake but I don't understand this joke at all.

Re: I want an iPhone Mini-sized Android phone (2022)

#607

The hard reality is that there is no PAYING market for such a device, because when it comes to the point-of-sale, most people still choose the normal-size device with better screen/battery/camera. This is equivalent to something I called the "QWERTY paradox" more than a decade ago: Back when the Smartphone market exploded, people disliked typing on a touchscreen and repeatedly stated that they want a device with a ph…

I think when people start using phones less, they will again want them to be small. That is my experience at least. That being said, I expect to have to go back to a full size phone before that happens.

People will never use phones less.

Re: I want an iPhone Mini-sized Android phone (2022)

#608

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are in agreement - you appear to be replying to my comment piece by piece without reading all of it. I'm speaking about the one-hand operability, which I then conclude must not be very important and obviously the market prefers something else. I will only address this part: > The market is optimizing for what consumers asked for This is hopelessly naive. This is true in the same sense that butane rings in cigarett…

> Consumers don't know what they want, they're fed whatever is going to make the most money by advertisers. And they will like it, because there is no other choice. Except we know this is not the reality in this case as the worlds most successful mobile device marketer has made multiple attempts to create and market smaller devices which time and time again the majority of consumers have rejected. The majority having…

Yes, again, similar to how a Tobacco consumer would reject older styles of Cigarettes. They were objectively worse - less nicotine, less impact on the brain, slower burning, and uneven burning. I used to smoke, ask me how I know.

> conspiracy of consumer stupidity

You misunderstand. Consumers aren't stupid, they're human. Human are remarkably easy to exploit. Exploiting the human mind is orders of magnitude easier than exploiting a computer.

I mean, you put a shiny machine in front of a human and tell them there's little to no chance they'll win money and they'll destroy themselves in front of it. Drain their bank accounts, ruin their marriage. You don't even have to lie - you can tell them gambling is bad, you can tell them they won't win, but that doesn't actually affect the exploit. Monkey brain see bright light, dopamine hits.

It's really quiet simple, and you're a market-minded man so you should be able to deduce this: it's all about incentives. You can continue to believe that the devices best for advertisers also happen to be what consumers want most. I think it's painfully naive, almost child-like.

I mean, look at smart TVs. Why do we have those? Do consumers prefer them? Sure. Is it to everyone's benefit that consumers prefer it? Certainly. So then we must ask - how did consumers come to prefer them? Was it, maybe, forced? Were they, maybe, exploited?

Just consider this. If I want to enter the Tobacco market, anywhere in the world, should I enter with a nicotine-free cigarette, or even a low-nicotine cigarette? Would those be successful? No, I think, the company would sink remarkably fast. We'd have no sales, consumers wouldn't buy it.

Re: I want an iPhone Mini-sized Android phone (2022)

#609
post #40

We've seen this story play out before. Every phone manufacturer has had the bright idea of introducing a small flagship. They spend a ton of money developing and marketing it. Internet people get excited. And when launched - no one buys it. They learn their lesson and move on.

Slight tangent, I thought nowadays everyone is (are?) internet people. Everyone's on their phone all the time. Even if it's tiktok or instagram, why aren't brands spending to reach this audience.

1% of people post/comment, 99% like/retweet or just read. everyone you read on the internet is weird by default

Re: I want an iPhone Mini-sized Android phone (2022)

#610
post #522
post #504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unihertz sells some decent Android phones that have 3 and 5 inch displays, respectively: https://www.unihertz.com AFAIK, these are similar to the iPhone SE? The SE form factor was great in terms of size and thickness. Easy to use with one hand. I miss that.

The Jelly Max looks really tempting, but I'm a little apprehensive after running the Jelly Star for a while and dealing with constant dropped calls and bad call quality all around.

I'm in a similar boat. I really (really!) wanted to love the jelly star (when I used it for almost a month), but on Verizon I didn't have an LTE signal most of the time in the Seattle area, including downtown, which I find unreasonable. Also the battery life was horrible, 20% per hour of active use and 4% per hour of standby.

Using the jelly star proved that using a small screen is not a problem for me and I would gladly pay money for an experience like that.

But it also proved that it is not an acceptable option in terms of quality. Hopefully the Jelly Max is better in these regards.

I think Jelly Max the ideal size for me too (jelly star was a little too small for doing driving navigation). I'll keep an ear out

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