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John Carmack's new AGI company, Keen Technologies, has raised a $20M round

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Re: John Carmack's new AGI company, Keen Technologies, has raised a $20M round

#601

Earlier quoted context omitted.

His reply to this tweet is that he didn't want to spend $20million of his own money on this venture. When you have the option to throw 20m on projects, you can spend it reasonably quickly.

His actual claim is that spending other people's money helps his focus because it makes him feel responsible. That's a plausible argument.

The first thing you want to hear as an investor is that the person you're investing into has as much skin in the game as possible so opening up with "I'm putting other people's money in this instead of mine" is not great.

Re: John Carmack's new AGI company, Keen Technologies, has raised a $20M round

#602

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He covers that in another video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3TYT1QfdfsM

Oh FFS. He starts off by giving the AGI a robot body that can kill things (don't do that in the first place!), and then he adds a stop button in a type of location that wouldn't pass muster on a table saw, let alone an industrial robot. If you've placed the stop button such that you cannot access it safely in all possible failure modes of the dangerous machine, be it bench grinder or an AGI or whatever, you have fail…

I don't think you spent enough time checking, he's a person with a PHD precisely in AI safety!

The type of reasoning you're displaying is addressed in another video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9i1WlcCudpU

Re: John Carmack's new AGI company, Keen Technologies, has raised a $20M round

#603
I hate the pop sci ill-defined notion of AGI. As soon as a task is defined, an AI is developed which completes the task from real world data with superhuman success. The work of making the superhuman model isn't even conceptual usually, it's a matter of dispatching training jobs. It's quite clear that if your definition of AGI is superhuman perf at arbitrary tasks, there's no conceptual barriers right now. Everything is mere scale, efficiency and orchestration.

Re: John Carmack's new AGI company, Keen Technologies, has raised a $20M round

#604

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was surprised by how bullish he is about this. At least a few years ago the experts in the field didn't see AGI anywhere near us for at least a few decades, and all of the bulls were physicists, philosophers or Deepak-Chopra-for-the-TED-crowd bullshit artists who have never written a line of code in their lives, mostly milking that conference and podcast dollar, preaching Skynet-flavored apocalypse or rapture. To s…

if Carmack's in I'm in. Has he ever been drastically wrong?

Has Carmack made a time bound prediction on AGI?

He can't ever be "wrong" on AGI if he hasn't even made a disprovable claim about AGI.

Re: John Carmack's new AGI company, Keen Technologies, has raised a $20M round

#605

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He mentioned, in his Lex Friedman interview, that accepting investor money was a way to keep himself serious and motivated. He feels an obligation to those putting their money in.

"I want other people's skin in the game instead of mine" is not necessarily virtuous.

Carmack’s goal is not to become the most virtuous person in the world. His goal is to make the AGI

Re: John Carmack's new AGI company, Keen Technologies, has raised a $20M round

#606

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Can someone please explain like we are fifteen why AGI is impossible, at least right now Probably not. I did attempt to give a high level explanation in another comment but I think there is this naive belief that complex problems can be distilled into terms that laymen can understand. This is such a complex problem that is so ill-defined that experts argue. I'm not sure there's really a good "explain it like I'm an…

>but I think there is this naive belief that complex problems can be distilled into terms that laymen can understand Naive people like Richard Feynman, who said if you can't explain an idea to an 8 year old, you don't understand it? Can you tell us why you think Nobel Prize winner Richard Feynman is naive?

He isn't, you are. Let's look at some other Feynman quotes which we can actually attribute (I can't find a real source for your claim though I've also heard it attributed to Einstein).

> Hell, if I could explain it to the average person, it wouldn't have been worth the Nobel prize.

> I can't explain [magnetic] attraction in terms of anything else that's familiar to you. For example, if I said the magnets attract like as if they were connected by rubber bands, I would be cheating you. Because they're not connected by rubber bands … and if you were curious enough, you'd ask me why rubber bands tend to pull back together again, and I would end up explaining that in terms of electrical forces, which are the very things that I'm trying to use the rubber bands to explain, so I have cheated very badly, you see."

> we have this terrible struggle to try to explain things to people who have no reason to want to know. But if they want to defend their own point of view, they will have to learn what yours is a little bit. So I suggest, maybe correctly and perhaps wrongly, that we are too polite.

My best guess is that this misattribution comes from quote ABOUT Feynman and a misunderstanding at what is being conveyed.

> Once I asked [Feynman] to explain to me, so that I can understand it, why spin-1/2 particles obey Fermi-Dirac statistics. Gauging his audience perfectly, he said, "I'll prepare a freshman lecture on it." But a few days later he came to me and said: "You know, I couldn't do it. I couldn't reduce it to the freshman level. That means we really don't understand it." - David L. Goodstein

Which doesn't mean what you're using your "quote" to mean. As I stated before, we (the scientific community), don't even know what intelligence is. We definitely don't understand it so I'm not sure how you'd expect us to explain it to an 8 year old. Lots of things can't be explained to an 8 year old. Good luck teaching them Lie Algebras or Gauge Theory. You can have an excellent understanding of these advanced topics and the only way that 8 year old is going to understand it is if they are a genius prodigy and well beyond a layman. This quote is just illogical and only used by people who think the world is far simpler than it is and are too lazy to actually pursue its beauty. They only want to sound smart and they only will to those dumber than them.

Stop saying this and get off your high horse and hit the books instead.

Maybe Feynman was right, we're being too polite. There are a bunch of people in this thread that are not arguing in good faith and pretending to be smarter than people that are experts and performing mental gymnastics to prove that (you are one but not alone). If an expert is telling you that you are using words wrong, then you probably are. Don't just assume you're smarter than an expert. You don't have the experience to have that ego.

https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Richard_Feynman

https://www.sciencealert.com/watch-richard-feynman-on-why-he....

Re: John Carmack's new AGI company, Keen Technologies, has raised a $20M round

#608
post #222

I'm slightly scared that they'll succeed. But not in the usual "robots will kill us" way. What I am afraid of is that they succeed, but it turns out similar to VR: as an inconsequential gimmick. That they use their AGIs to serve more customized ads to people, and that's where it ends.

My great short-term hope for "AGI" is truly open-world video games, where you can weave your own story and the world will react in kind. I played AI Dungeon a few times, and the results were hilariously fun though pretty rough around the edges.

Re: John Carmack's new AGI company, Keen Technologies, has raised a $20M round

#609

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like bad logic. If he gets bored/throw in towel, he can just pay back with his money and move on. Also, if you need to create such artificial constraints in order to go to work, a main ingredient called “drive” is missing. I respect Carmack a lot but I don’t trust old centi-millionaires to work with same passion as their younger poorer selves. Finally, $20M is too low. AGI is not a solo endeavor and doesn’t…

> " If he gets bored/throw in towel, he can just pay back with his money and move on." > "Just to train a large model once will eat up 20% of this money." Aren't these 2 statements conflicting?

No, because he has that amount of money on hand himself.

Re: John Carmack's new AGI company, Keen Technologies, has raised a $20M round

#610

Does anyone else subscribe to the idea that AGI is impossible/unlikely without 'embodied cognition', i.e. we cannot create a human-like 'intelligence' unless it has a similar embodiment to us, able to move around a physical environment with it's own limbs, sense of touch, sight, etc. ? Any arguments against the necessity of this? I feel like any AGI developed in silico without freedom of movement will be fundamentall…

What's the difference between moving around and picking up a document, to say hitting an API endpoint to fetch the content of the same document?
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