Earlier quoted context omitted.
You don't want to create a class of people who get paid badly because their jobs are terrible (and also low-skilled.) The only reason you would want a lower minimum wage for young people is because young people are stupid, and you want to put them into a job where they can learn i.e. low-skilled, but ramping up over time, like an apprenticeship. Paying people almost nothing to work a horrible job because you can get…
You keep using the word class, but I don't think it's applicable here. If everyone in the country is subjected to a lower minimum wage while a teenager, there is no disadvantaged "class".
Labor shortage or terrible jobs?
601–610 of 1001 posts
Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?
#602Earlier quoted context omitted.
Apologies, but I'd rather not reveal too much personal info. But I did get need-based financial assistance in university. And I did attend a low cost school for financial reasons. I didn't "pay my way through school washing dishes" or anything like that. I wasn't supported by my family so the extra income through low pay jobs was critical.
Oh no problem, I'm just pointing out that both your experiences can be valid at the same time
Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?
#603Earlier quoted context omitted.
Currently, US capitalists exploit workers both in the US and in poorer countries, with the later being super-exploited. Under this arrangement, the vast majority of the value created by both groups of workers is captured by a handful of capitalists. A socialist US would cease exploiting other countries (including China) and instead pursue mutually beneficial trade (much like China does). This would likely include som…
US trade with China is currently mutually beneficial. That's why China participates. Give me more detail on what that means. If the US Communist party took over absolute leadership of the US tomorrow, what differences would there be in the US China trade agreement.
One recent example is Bolivia’s rare earth mining. A German company was offering only ~5% of the value of extracted material in exchange for the capital required, while a Chinese SOE offered 50%. Not long after there was a US-backed fascist coup which was only recently defeated.
Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?
#604Earlier quoted context omitted.
But that has nothing to do with GP's claim? GP was talking about your "net pay is below zero", meaning that the job itself pays negative. eg. you get paid $50/day but spent $55/day to earn it. Your comment seems to be about the minimum wage not being able to sustain a given living standard, eg. you get paid $50/day but you need to spend $55/day to survive.
I read their comment differently than you did, but even if I hadn't I don't quite understand your objection. By definition if you're spending $55/day to survive, you're spending $55/day to earn your pay, if nothing more. The situation you describe is not sustainable either. Please clarify.
"net pay is below zero" means (In his interpretation) that the cost of having the job is greater than the amount the job pays. This is unrelated to the cost of surviving.
Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?
#605Honest question: why do discussions about minimum wage in the U.S. never propose having teenagers having a different minimum to adults? In australia we have a $12.50/hr minimum for 15 year olds. It climbs in increments until about $25/hr. This system allows teenagers to get a foot in the door for low-skilled jobs, and allows adults to get paid a livable wage. The result is that a lot of fast food jobs are performed b…
Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?
#606Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think the effects of price stickiness (on goods and labor) aren’t being adequately considered in these discussions. Yes, these restaurants could raise their wages to compete with unemployment, and many have. They’ll also need to raise their prices, which they have leeway to do, because everyone is facing the same costs. The problem occurs in a few months when the bonus unemployment runs out. Then there will be mill…
Rising the minimum wage is exactly the thing that should not be done, if one cares about the employment levels. It prices out the least qualified workforce of the market. To put it simply the less able/educated/experienced are not productive enough to cover own costs. So that no one wants to employ them and they are stuck. They start to rely on the government to provide them with resources and it means that have to v…
Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?
#607Earlier quoted context omitted.
The average age of a fast food worker is 29.5. https://www.davemanuel.com/2011/04/21/the-average-age-of-a-f...
Is that the mean age or the median age? The article doesn't really provide a source.
Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?
#608Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Please, define what is a poverty wage, it is important. The ability to afford adequate housing, food, and clothing. I'm not saying we should mandate people can afford a 1500 sq. ft. home, ribeye steaks every evening, and Ralph Lauren Polo threads, but how about at least a one bedroom, one bathroom apartment; nutritious, nourishing food; Walmart clothing at a minimum. > What is the change of the model in case of the…
> The ability to afford adequate housing, food, and clothing. I'm not saying we should mandate people can afford a 1500 sq. ft. home, ribeye steaks every evening, and Ralph Lauren Polo threads, but how about at least a one bedroom, one bathroom apartment; nutritious, nourishing food; Walmart clothing at a minimum. Now, what does adequate mean? I guess a place to sleep, a place to clean oneself, food and clothing seem…
I would say, a place where you don't have to share quarters with strangers, be exposed to violence, drugs, have your sleep interrupted, where the housing is stable enough that you don't need to leave work in the middle of the day to attend an emergency court petition to prevent your immediate eviction due to landlords non-payment of mortgage and interception of mailed eviction notifications, where you don't have to leave under cover of darkness with colleagues who know how to handle themselves as your bodyguards so that you can spend a month or two sleeping on a friends sofa while you try and wait for a room to open up in something resembling a half-way house for recently released prisoners.
Cos I mean, those were about the best conditions I could afford while working for a profitable multinational tech company while I was developing a key piece of the Internet infrastructure that everyone on this site uses daily (in a wealthy area of the UK).
I won't name the company, but it rhymes with "Clit Tricks"
> Are there really only two options? Is not that a bit simplistic? ... should we provide them with the exact stuff that people who work 40h a week get ... ?
Is _that_ not a bit simplistic? Is it really so difficult to imagine a world where working 40 hours a week is either a) dignified enough not to be totally demeaning and exploitative _and_ meaningful enough to carry some intrinsic reward, or b) pays noticeably more than the bare minimum required for an existence at least befitting the dignity of animals in a zoo, never mind human beings?
Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?
#609Earlier quoted context omitted.
That incentivizes companies to hire teenagers instead of adults
It also incentivizes teenagers to work instead of hang around parking lots being goofballs.
Re: Labor shortage or terrible jobs?
#610Earlier quoted context omitted.
I had this concern until I realized teenagers have to go to school so there’s a huge chunk of the day that they cannot work. Adults have to take those shifts. This realization also led me to determine that these jobs aren’t purely for teenagers despite hearing all my life burger-flipping was for teens.
Not all teenagers are required to go to school. Dropping out is possible, and usually 18/19 y/o don't have high school