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Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

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Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#601

Post by dragonwriter »

nobody9999 wrote: post #467
xxpor wrote: post #418

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You might have had a minimal argument pre-17th Amendment, but that's not how the world works any more. In addition, there's 0 reason for the house to be as malapportioned as it is. 435 house members isn't written in the constitution. Third, the entire concept of smaller states having an outsized voice in the federal government comes from the slave owners from the South in 1789. There's no rational basis for it any lo…

>Third, the entire concept of smaller states having an outsized voice in the federal government comes from the slave owners from the South in 1789. There's no rational basis for it any longer. No. It had to do with Connecticut, New Jersey and other small population states who wouldn't have ratified the Constitution unless there was state representation (as we have in the Senate) to balance out the representation by p…

> The southern states had (or expected to have) large populations

The Southern States were underrepresented in the Senate compared to the House by the initial apportionment in the Constitution, represented at very close to the same ratio in each House in the apportionment for the 1790 Census (largely reflecting that they had been overrepresented relative to population, in the House, in the Constitutional apportionment), and substantially overrepresented in the Senate compared to the House after the 1800 Census.

They were well aware of the imminent demographic trends and acted accordingly.

> History and facts matter.

Indeed they do, but the history and facts aren't on the side of “the Southern States had large initial and expected future populations as counted for apportionment in the House and, so by-State representation in the Senate was contrary to, rather than designed to serve, their regional interest.”

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#602

Post by maxsilver »

filleduchaos wrote: post #430
cat199 wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But I'm not aware of even a single left-leaning politician in any federal elected office. For example, no elected federal politician is advocating for the nationalization of all private corporations, or elimination of all for-profit entities, or for a complete cap on individual wealth, or for giving Hawaii back to the aboriginal Hawaiians, or anything like that, so, given this, that NPR is right-leaning, and bernie…

Not an American, but > NPR is right-leaning Yes. > bernie/AOC are 'centrist' Yes. Though I would describe Sanders as left-of-centre (apart from her stance on the environment, Ocasio-Cortez is quite the centrist). > am I correct in your assessment that basically just about only bolshevism counts as 'left'? No. There is an entire range of actual leftist politics and economics that Americans tend to utterly refuse to en…

I don't know why this is getting downvoted. As an American, all of the above seems completely correct.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#603

Post by stale2002 »

filleduchaos wrote: post #582
stale2002 wrote: post #527

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

See, this is the exact refusal to engage in good faith that I'm talking about. The red scare really did do a number on y'all. Geopolitically speaking, opposition to colonialism and imperialism (and their neo- variants) are generally considered to be leftist ideals. Internationalism skews left and globalism skews right, despite American conservatives' pearl-clutching in that regard. Decentralisation of power (with the…

I noticed that instead of responding to my examples of actual leftist governments, with a series of your own examples of major leftist governments that are "not super evil", or are more fair examples, you instead responded with general ideals.

Yeah, no. If someone is going to call AOC or Bernie Sanders as "centrists", then I am going to need you to point to an actual, real life example of a true "leftist" government to understand wtf you are talking about.

Examples are needed so you can't make a bunch of stuff up, and wash you hands with the actual, real life examples of how your "ideals" turned out in real life.

> unwilling to actually engage with what leftism means

Hey, I did try to give examples of actual leftist governments, so we can evaluate how those real life, not made up in your head, examples actually turned out.

When talking about this stuff, the only actual thing that I will except is real life examples of your ideal government. Because, if I don't do that, then leftists will just make a bunch of stuff up, that is not grounded in reality.

Unfortunately the gap in what a leftist will claim that they want, and how they claim things will turn out is miles and miles away different from how actual leftist governments attempt to implement their ideals.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#604

Post by amanaplanacanal »

stale2002 wrote: post #526
amanaplanacanal wrote: post #435

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds like you are suggesting that regulations should never change. Is that what you mean?

No. That is not what the other person said. Did you accidently respond to the wrong comment? What the person said was that a chemical manufacturing company should not be "biting their nails" over some random Marijuana decrimininalization speech, that a random candidate is making.

At the end he was talking about changing the rules on effluents. I guess I just doing understand what he is trying to say.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#605

Post by Consultant32452 »

user-the-name wrote: post #543
Consultant32452 wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I addressed those claims in my last paragraph.

If by "addressed" you mean "mentioned and ignored", then yes.

Here is Twitter failing to protect a sex trafficked child despite multiple written requests. Twitter just signed a very big contract with AWS.

https://uncoverdc.com/2021/01/21/doe-v-twitter-twitter-fails...

Come back to me when AWS drops Twitter's new contract. Then we'll talk about whether or not Twitter has any moderation. We'll discuss whether Twitter is designed specifically to facilitate child trafficking. And every other formulation of this narrative.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#606

Post by nobody9999 »

dragonwriter wrote: post #601
nobody9999 wrote: post #467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Third, the entire concept of smaller states having an outsized voice in the federal government comes from the slave owners from the South in 1789. There's no rational basis for it any longer. No. It had to do with Connecticut, New Jersey and other small population states who wouldn't have ratified the Constitution unless there was state representation (as we have in the Senate) to balance out the representation by p…

> The southern states had (or expected to have) large populations The Southern States were underrepresented in the Senate compared to the House by the initial apportionment in the Constitution, represented at very close to the same ratio in each House in the apportionment for the 1790 Census (largely reflecting that they had been overrepresented relative to population, in the House, in the Constitutional apportionmen…

>The Southern States were underrepresented in the Senate compared to the House by the initial apportionment in the Constitution, represented at very close to the same ratio in each House in the apportionment for the 1790 Census (largely reflecting that they had been overrepresented relative to population, in the House, in the Constitutional apportionment), and substantially overrepresented in the Senate compared to the House after the 1800 Census.

That's orthogonal to the concerns of small population states, in 1787, when the Connecticut Compromise was adopted.

What's more, the results of 1790 and 1800 Censuses didn't impact support or opposition to that compromise, as they hadn't been performed yet.

>by-State representation in the Senate was contrary to, rather than designed to serve, their regional interest.”

Which is the flip-side of the coin to what I said.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#607

Post by cairoshikobon »

takeda wrote: post #276
ssully wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When did half the population have their speech banned?

The whole argument is so silly. Trump could snap a finger and have cameras ready to air on national TV whatever he wanted to say. If Valve bans me from Steam for my language is that also violation of my free speech or is it their right to protect their platform?

> snap a finger and have cameras ready to air on national TV

You do realize both ABC and CNN literally went live and said they won't air his speech, right?

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#608

Post by fl0wenol »

mercurialshark wrote: post #162
mercurialshark wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tech attorney here (with no relation to this specific matter). I wouldn't say they don't have a leg to stand on. I think it will prove to be very interesting.

Without addressing the specifics of the TRO (which is simply an early stage request for injunctive relief, asking the court to compel AWS to reinstate services pending litigation): Packinghan v North Carolina (2017) - Access to social media and digital infrastructure cannot be prohibited by the state. Marsh v Alabama (1946) - Constitutional protections of 1st and 14th amendments applicable within confines of “town” o…

The analogies for the digital town/community break down when we consider certain practical and physical barriers that exist in company towns that do not exist in the digital realm. For example, the travel expenses and time required to purchase goods. You could go outside the company town, but it requires much more resources to do so, which is doubly impacted by pay being docked accordingly to bundled company town services (utility, rent, etc.), which traps residents. This is why they have been looked upon unfavorably.

But digital communities do not trap individuals, there is no practical limit except of mental effort to the number of accounts or social media networks a person can simultaneously use. Instead, the costs are borne by the networks themselves, which scales with the number of users.

This is an inversion of the scenario as the public is a passive participant, nothing is forced upon them. This is why I think the argument is not a good fit.

Parler and AWS, as business entities, can only act in their own interests as there is no duty between a corporation and the general public, only their customers through either a uniform or contractual relationship. Wouldn't you agree? It would be dangerous to assume that a corporation has a specific duty to the general public beyond existing customers. That is, AWS only has to deal with Parler, not Parler's customers. That is on Parler.

And I don't think the state enters into this at all.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#609

Post by fl0wenol »

echelon wrote: post #186
duskwuff wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> he was saying that their tech rep at Amazon gave no hints that they were in danger of being shut down And I wouldn't expect them to do so! They're a tech rep, not a legal rep.

So deplatforming by surprise is okay? Facebook and Twitter don't own their data centers. If the DCs responded to the same pressure about hosting illegal content, the social media giants would disappear too. Edit: the downvotes and rate limits are about to push me away from HN for good. This is ridiculous. My platform is anti-fascism. I'm tired of people on both sides trying to shut down the other side.

> So deplatforming by surprise is okay?

Yes. Abuse and copyright violation doesn't get a pass, so why should extremism?

You take calculated risks in these industries when you're using a service provider. Depends on your goals. Sucks to suck.

Re: Judge refuses to reinstate Parler after Amazon shut it down

#610

Post by fl0wenol »

cairoshikobon wrote: post #607
takeda wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole argument is so silly. Trump could snap a finger and have cameras ready to air on national TV whatever he wanted to say. If Valve bans me from Steam for my language is that also violation of my free speech or is it their right to protect their platform?

> snap a finger and have cameras ready to air on national TV You do realize both ABC and CNN literally went live and said they won't air his speech, right?

God I hope so. He got his 15 minutes his whole wasted life.
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