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Physical Intuition, Not Mathematics (2011)

realphysics.blogspot.com

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Re: Physical Intuition, Not Mathematics (2011)

#61

Does anyone have a good theory for what they think intuition is? I'm interested in process. What is the mapping algorithm that transforms problem into solution? While intuition appears to be magic, I believe that there is a very concrete process happening in our subconscious. My personal guess is that we're transforming the problem into a format more suited for different modules of our brain to process. For the table…

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Re: Physical Intuition, Not Mathematics (2011)

#62

Does anyone have a good theory for what they think intuition is? I'm interested in process. What is the mapping algorithm that transforms problem into solution? While intuition appears to be magic, I believe that there is a very concrete process happening in our subconscious. My personal guess is that we're transforming the problem into a format more suited for different modules of our brain to process. For the table…

The idea of intuition is explored in psychology through Dual Process Theory. See "Dual-process accounts of reasoning" below.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_process_theory#Dual-proce...

Kahneman and Tversky spent a good deal of time trying to identify the major heuristics employed (and biases caused) by the more "intuitive" of the two systems used for thinking.

(You may note that at the time this paper was published there was no concept of Dual Processes and the phrases "System 1/2" are never used.)

http://psiexp.ss.uci.edu/research/teaching/Tversky_Kahneman_...

Re: Physical Intuition, Not Mathematics (2011)

#63
It strikes me as kind of silly the way he tries to separate the mathematics (i.e. what he calls simple calculations) from the physical intuition; all mathematics beyond say sophomore year in college is very intuitive but at an abstract level (and the earlier stuff too, they just teach the early calc/stats classes to scientists/engineers so they drop the intuition and make it about pure mindless calculation), mathematicians are primarily intuitive creatures who have just developed intuition over years of hard work about abstract objects which are far more difficult to intuit about than, say, a table.

Re: Physical Intuition, Not Mathematics (2011)

#64
post #22

Feynman also said the following (in the "The Character of Physical Law" lectures): Every one of our laws is a purely mathematical statement in rather complex and abstruse mathematics. Newton's statement of the law of gravitation is relatively simple mathematics. It gets more and more abstruse and more and more difficult as we go on. Why? I have not the slightest idea. It is only my purpose here to tell you about this…

I think just as much as it's important to have intuition is to have a healthy relationship with your intuition. Knowing when to trust it and when not to. Intuition often happily leads you very far down the wrong path. Math can, too, obviously, but doing math properly involves many self checks. You frame the problem in many different ways and can see if they line up. Your intuition is just the way you see the world. If the way you see the world happens to be wrong, you'll think the wrong thing. For instance, I might intuitively think that if I digitize a band limited analog signal I'm throwing something useful away... that you're throwing away the data between the samples. There's clearly wiggles there... those wiggles must encode something! It turns out though that a digitally sampled band limited signal can be perfectly reproduced. Perfectly. That's totally counter-intuitive, by which I mean there's little real world experience that would tell you otherwise!

So, I think you should think about intuition, math, whatever else you have in your pocket as tools. They give the right answer when used correctly and sometimes give the wrong answer even when you're sure you're using them correctly. I think though that intuition CAN be more insidious because it's what you've experienced! It HAS to be true, you think.

Re: Physical Intuition, Not Mathematics (2011)

#65

A problem is that the reverse is also true. Simple example: stretch a rope around the earth that fits tightly and add 1 m to the length. Can a cat go under the rope (it's always a cat). Intuitively that seems like a "No". The simplest of formulae says "Yes" ( 1m/2pis = +/- 15 cm). Here, pretty much everyone has to resist intuition and trust numbers. I think the best way to conceptualize intuition is some sort of unco…

Intuitively it can also be answered: suppose you pinch the rope, so it is tight (you step on it and pull from between your two feet, for example). You'd have a handle for the earth that will go to about just above your knee. A cat fits!

Good point. That's the power of thought-experiments! It's about stimulating intuition.

Re: Physical Intuition, Not Mathematics (2011)

#66

Intuitions are insights (hints) from so-called ancient, non-verbal (pre-linguistic) instinctive "knowledge" or "genetic memory". It is not only the kind of knowledge of how birds "know" how to make nests or men know to run out of building when earthquake happen (without any prior training), but also intuitive knowledge about the nature of reality, properties of physical environment, which has been "trained" before an…

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Re: Physical Intuition, Not Mathematics (2011)

#67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wrong on two levels: Our physical intuitions are Galilean, not classical, mechanics (that is, they are non-Newtonian). For example, our intuitions tell us that an object set in motion eventually slows down and stops. That's Galilean (also termed "folk physics" or "naive physics", usually by cognitive scientists). Most of us had to study formal physics to advance to Newtonian classical mechanics. Quantum mechanics (QM…

I think you're calling Aristotelian physics "Galilean mechanics."

You're right, my bad! I should have said "Aristotelian mechanics" instead of "Galilean mechanics". Galileo saw his physical intuitions but, being the scientist he was, corrected them.

Re: Physical Intuition, Not Mathematics (2011)

#68
post #40
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I discovered this last year after arrogantly jumping into the first volume of Feynmans Lectures on Physics. 50 pages in, I decided to take a step back and read a calculus book first, but wait my algebra and trig are crap so back to the basics. So yesterday I hit LCM and GCD applications and factoring which are very basic. So, I'll probably resume the initial book in a couple of years or so...

Math is wide and deep. You won’t need to cover every topic in math to get going with physics. If you really are interested in physics there are many things in math, which are, well, less important (for doing basic physics). For example LCM, GCD and factoring. I guess, these things are somewhat important in Computer Science, but I never encountered them in a physics problem. So to get started with physics, I would sug…

On a related note, Mary Boas's text, Mathematical Methods in the Physical Sciences does a great job of giving you the necessary bag of tricks to learn all of undergraduate level physics (and probably much more) without diving too deep into any single topic. It should be sufficient to give you lots of intuition until you decide to pursue something at much greater depth (although doing that alone, and without a professor/PI/expert of some sort is realistically, almost definitely a waste of effort).

Re: Physical Intuition, Not Mathematics (2011)

#69

A problem is that the reverse is also true. Simple example: stretch a rope around the earth that fits tightly and add 1 m to the length. Can a cat go under the rope (it's always a cat). Intuitively that seems like a "No". The simplest of formulae says "Yes" ( 1m/2pis = +/- 15 cm). Here, pretty much everyone has to resist intuition and trust numbers. I think the best way to conceptualize intuition is some sort of unco…

Intuitively it can also be answered: suppose you pinch the rope, so it is tight (you step on it and pull from between your two feet, for example). You'd have a handle for the earth that will go to about just above your knee. A cat fits!

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Re: Physical Intuition, Not Mathematics (2011)

#70

A problem is that the reverse is also true. Simple example: stretch a rope around the earth that fits tightly and add 1 m to the length. Can a cat go under the rope (it's always a cat). Intuitively that seems like a "No". The simplest of formulae says "Yes" ( 1m/2pis = +/- 15 cm). Here, pretty much everyone has to resist intuition and trust numbers. I think the best way to conceptualize intuition is some sort of unco…

Maybe youre right, but your example is not a good one. Your problem reduces to, does 1m of rope provide enough to cover a cat? You actually have greater than 1m of rope since the cat has width.

Maybe a better example is, what is the best way to accelerate a ball horizontally from a fixed height? IE how can we most efficiently translate potential energy to kinetic energy in the horizontal direction?

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