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Tarsnap performance issues in late March, most of April

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Re: Tarsnap performance issues in late March, most of April

#61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We actually have our Chef rdiff backup cookbook randomly distribute jobs across a buckets of time using a hash function of the hostname.

I have to know: Why a hash function of the hostname?

The chef-client cookbook does a similar thing in its cron recipe:

  # Generate a uniformly distributed unique number to sleep.
  if node['chef_client']['splay'].to_i > 0
    checksum   = Digest::MD5.hexdigest(node['fqdn'] || 'unknown-hostname')
    sleep_time = checksum.to_s.hex % node['chef_client']['splay'].to_i
  else
    sleep_time = nil
  end
https://github.com/opscode-cookbooks/chef-client/blob/master...

This is random enough so you won't kill the server, and deterministic so the resource isn't always changing every Chef run.

Re: Tarsnap performance issues in late March, most of April

#62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the picodollars - tarsnap was the second business I fell in love with on HN (the late Kiko was #1) purely because of the awesome vibe I felt emanating from your enterprise (which I'm assuming is a reflection on you as well). Years later, you've also become a cause celebre for holding true to a clear business and lifestyle vision (again, perceived at distance), in spite of the recommendations and 'support' provid…

It's the picodollars Hey Thomas, are you listening here? In all seriousness, the picodollars do an excellent job of attracting exactly the sort of customers I want... and turning away the customers I don't want. They were originally part joke and part a way to avoid arguments with customers who don't understand that 1 GB in spite of the recommendations and 'support' provided by Patrick and others Don't be too harsh o…

Don't get me wrong - I probably still agree with Patrick and Thomas.

(Previous: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7731268)

[Edit: And I think the competing theories are an excellent lesson for that "kid right out of university who has never had a real job".]

Re: Tarsnap performance issues in late March, most of April

#63
post #36

As an AWS user this type of thing gives me cause for concern: At 2015-04-01 00:00 UTC, the Amazon EC2 "provisioned I/O" volume on which most of this metadata was stored suddenly changed from an average latency of 1.2 ms per request to an average latency of 2.2 ms per request. I have no idea why this happened -- indeed, I was so surprised by it that I didn't believe Amazon's monitoring systems at first -- but this imm…

Indeed, I didn't know such a change was possible -- that EBS volume went for years with consistent low latency before it suddenly slowed down.

You could have contacted AWS support or emailed me. Either way, we would have investigated.

Re: Tarsnap performance issues in late March, most of April

#64
post #59

I suppose I should have known that this would end up at the top of Hacker News...

Hey man, awesome writeup. I have a suggestion for you: try and architect off those EBS volumes -- as you unfortunately learned the hard way, they just aren't that consistent. DynamoDB is a good option, or adding some redundancy so that you can just use the ephemeral disk would be even better (and probably cost neutral compared to the "consistent" I/O EBS volumes). Happy to help if you'd like.

try and architect off those EBS volumes

Yeah, that has been a work in progress for a long time. FWIW, I started using piops volumes when they were the only SSD option available -- they beat the crap out of spinning ephemeral disks.

Re: Tarsnap performance issues in late March, most of April

#65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, I didn't know such a change was possible -- that EBS volume went for years with consistent low latency before it suddenly slowed down.

You could have contacted AWS support or emailed me. Either way, we would have investigated.

It wasn't missing its guaranteed # of I/Os per second, so I figured the slowdown was just "one of those things" and not an out-of-spec issue. Happy to send you the volume ID if you think someone would want to investigate (and still has data from the start of April) though.

Re: Tarsnap performance issues in late March, most of April

#66
post #38
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

whistles Until the day when Colin considers it in-scope for Tarsnap, I recommend Deadman's Snitch for this purpose. I literally spend more on DMS to monitor Tarsnap than I spend on Tarsnap. No, I don't think that is just, either.

Don't you have some other servers running other services? So you must already have some monitoring and alerting system like Nagios, to which you can add one more little "passive check" that does the same thing, for no incremental cost?

I have roughly fourish separate monitoring systems for Appointment Reminder. DMS is the one which is least tied to me, so I use it for Tarsnap (the most critical thing about AR that can fail "quietly") and as the fourthish line of defense for the core AR functionality.

(This may be slightly overbuilt, but I felt it justified to get peace of mind, given AR's fair degree of importance to customers/myself and the enterprise-y customer base. In particular, I would not have been happy with any monitoring solution which would fail if I lost network connectivity at the data center.)

$15 a month is far below my care floor for making sure that my backups are working and that I do not get sued into bits.

Re: Tarsnap performance issues in late March, most of April

#67
post #66
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't you have some other servers running other services? So you must already have some monitoring and alerting system like Nagios, to which you can add one more little "passive check" that does the same thing, for no incremental cost?

I have roughly fourish separate monitoring systems for Appointment Reminder. DMS is the one which is least tied to me, so I use it for Tarsnap (the most critical thing about AR that can fail "quietly") and as the fourthish line of defense for the core AR functionality. (This may be slightly overbuilt, but I felt it justified to get peace of mind, given AR's fair degree of importance to customers/myself and the enterp…

Touché :)

Re: Tarsnap performance issues in late March, most of April

#68
post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hey man, awesome writeup. I have a suggestion for you: try and architect off those EBS volumes -- as you unfortunately learned the hard way, they just aren't that consistent. DynamoDB is a good option, or adding some redundancy so that you can just use the ephemeral disk would be even better (and probably cost neutral compared to the "consistent" I/O EBS volumes). Happy to help if you'd like.

try and architect off those EBS volumes Yeah, that has been a work in progress for a long time. FWIW, I started using piops volumes when they were the only SSD option available -- they beat the crap out of spinning ephemeral disks.

> when they were the only SSD option available -- they beat the crap out of spinning ephemeral disks.

No doubt!

What sort of stateful storage are you using on those EBS volumes?

If you're doing key/value, you might want to check out https://github.com/Netflix/dynomite

It turns redis into a dynamo-like key value store that might bootstrap your transition.

Re: Tarsnap performance issues in late March, most of April

#69
post #56
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Finally, numbers other than picodollars and gigabyte months and unpredictable deduplication. This convinces me I don't want to store 4TB there at a huge cost($12,000 if it's really $300 a year for 100GB) compared to buying two 4TB drives (~€250 per 3-4 years) and placing them at a friend's with free bandwidth. Don't get me wrong: managed, off-site encrypted backups are very attractive, and I might be willing to pay a…

Tarsnap isn't intended to be used as one-time backup like that, and it's super expensive if used that way. It's very cheap when used to backup (almost) the same 4GB for 1000 days in a row, which is what a lot of people/businesses need for their backup solutions.

It's not one time, I'd be incrementally writing updates to the disks. With a raspberry pi or something, the power costs are near negligible.
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