Why haven't China's cities learned from America's mistakes? • Hacker News Board

Re: Why haven't China's cities learned from America's mistakes?

#61

Post by lucasf » Thu, Aug 28, 2014, 11:00 PM UTC

martythemaniak wrote: post #7

The short, glib answer is "The same reason teenagers don't learn from their elders' mistakes". The longer answer is a combination of: - poor people want what rich people have. And if they can't afford the substance (private country estate), they'll still get the style (McMansion). They particularly want last generation's rich people's things, as this generation's rich people's things are have not gained widespread po…

Martythemaniak, Could you please give some examples of this generation's rich people's things that haven't gained widespread popularity yet?

Re: Why haven't China's cities learned from America's mistakes?

#62

Post by reedlaw » Fri, Aug 29, 2014, 12:51 AM UTC

gurkendoktor wrote: post #34

reedlaw wrote: post #24

I live in Hangzhou and they are already addressing these problems. For example, there is a network of public bike stations. To use a bike, you make a 200 yuan deposit on a public transportation card. The first hour bike rental is free. After that it starts at 1 yuan for the second hour and goes up from there. The card also works for buses (a ride costs 2-4 yuan) using your available balance. After riding a bus, the f…

> I live in Hangzhou and they are already addressing these problems. For example, there is a network of public bike stations. Do people use these in your experience? I've noticed them pop up all over Germany and then Taiwan too, but I found it hard to spot anyone but tourists riding public bikes. I always wonder if these are simply prestige projects to impress green-minded citizens (like myself).

Yes, they are used a lot. Sometimes a whole station will be empty, but they have staff who help replenish bikes in those cases. Hangzhou is a heavily touristed city and there are a lot more tourists using the bikes around the scenic spots. But I live far away from tourist spots and there are plenty of bike stations around and plenty of people using them.

Re: Why haven't China's cities learned from America's mistakes?

#63

Post by WildUtah » Fri, Aug 29, 2014, 4:43 AM UTC

winter_blue wrote: post #29

WildUtah wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

no matter the style of governance or how markets deal with housing, it seems like people converge on the same poor urban planning Actually, the USA is known for its soviet style command and control urban planning. China is known for direct state control as well. In either country you can expect to be told what you can build, how big it can be, setbacks, parking, street access, and lot sizes. USA cities are laid out w…

This is very enlightening indeed. Do you have sources to back them up?

That's a lot of ideas accumulated over years of experience. Is there one in particular that you'd like to read more about?

Re: Why haven't China's cities learned from America's mistakes?

#64

Post by WildUtah » Fri, Aug 29, 2014, 4:59 AM UTC

eloisant wrote: post #26

snogglethorpe wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you look at Japan, which generally has much looser zoning practices, it's managed to do much, much, better. It has sprawl and excess road construction too, but the sprawl is much more transit-oriented, and Japan has generally done a far better job avoiding the worst stupidities of U.S. post-war development. I'm sure there are many interacting reason for this, e.g. Japan's poverty in the decades after the war meant…

It may also be because in Japan space is very constrained, while China is a huge country with a lot available space - just like US.

China has eleven times the population of Japan and five times the habitable area.

Not far in from the coast, China turns into 2500m+ mountains with Siberian winters and few flat places. Then comes Tibet, the Mongolian desert, and the Gobi desert. None of those places will support cities, and most are dominated by non-Chinese people like Uigurs, Tibetans, Mongolians, and such. The vast majority of China on the map will never be Chinese and never support a major city.