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CentOS 7 released on x86_64

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Re: CentOS 7 released on x86_64

#61

Post by sliverstorm »

Florin_Andrei wrote: post #55
sliverstorm wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, I know, but I've been happily using CentOS 6 on my 128MB box, and was looking forward to CentOS 7.

> I've been happily using CentOS 6 on my 128MB box I used to do that too, but then I figured there's a constructive use I could give to my old desktops when any such system reaches the age of replacement - just max it out on RAM and declare it a "home server". Now I can run a Minecraft node for my kids on it - with 2GB of Java heap, no less. I mean, my Raspberry Pi has more than 128 MB of RAM. Lots of RAM - like chic…

Oh, RAM sticks are cheap, esp. for old machines. This is true. But I use a VPS, and the 128MB instances are cheap enough to be worth taking ten minutes to shut off junk services (which improves security anyway).

Re: CentOS 7 released on x86_64

#62

Post by devicenull »

kureikain wrote: post #43

I always scare of CentOS/Fedora. Whenever I updated something, it will be very old packages. Leading to use 3rd repo, and without any kind of document, the next sysadmin will be in trouble. I used to install Gearman on Centos 5.9 and it was a nightmare: the original 3rd repo didn't have gearman and I have to use other repo which is complain about PHP-Common conflicting. Remi and webtactic did help at the end. It's ha…

The issue is not the package manager, the issue is the repositories you're enabling. See https://iuscommunity.org/pages/TheSafeRepoInitiative.html for details.

Re: CentOS 7 released on x86_64

#63

Post by Florin_Andrei »

sliverstorm wrote: post #61
Florin_Andrei wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I've been happily using CentOS 6 on my 128MB box I used to do that too, but then I figured there's a constructive use I could give to my old desktops when any such system reaches the age of replacement - just max it out on RAM and declare it a "home server". Now I can run a Minecraft node for my kids on it - with 2GB of Java heap, no less. I mean, my Raspberry Pi has more than 128 MB of RAM. Lots of RAM - like chic…

Oh, RAM sticks are cheap, esp. for old machines. This is true. But I use a VPS, and the 128MB instances are cheap enough to be worth taking ten minutes to shut off junk services (which improves security anyway).

It might be worth trying to install it on a larger instance, save the image, and re-launch it into a 128 MB instance. It might work that way.

Re: CentOS 7 released on x86_64

#64

Post by xorcist »

jfindley wrote: post #39
jrslack wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Oh, an embedded HTTP server is loaded to read them. QR codes are served, as well. And outright falsehoods. systemd-journald-gatewayd is entirely optional. People keep harping on a packaging mistake when it was first pushed to Fedora for testing, but repeating it so many times doesn't make it true. >In fact, udev merged with systemd a long time ago systemd relies on udev and dbus, but udev doesn't pull in systemd as…

I'd be very interested to see a qualified crypto expert on the "sealing" that journald uses. This is one of two indicators of a troubling level of arrogance from the developers. The crypto method used by journald to verify messages haven't been tampered with is called Forward Secure Sealing [0]. It's based on an invention of the brother of Lennart - the lead developer, and for a long time after first release even the…

Relevant work in the area is Log Hash Chaining as described in RFC 5848, which at least has been through some peer review.

I don't know why they chose to ignore that, let alone what their design is really supposed to guard against. Their design allows an attacker a window of 15 minutes where they can rewrite the log at will.

So the short of it is: Keep using remote logging. Authenticate that. Don't rely on journald.

(I too have had Drepper vibes about the whole situation for quite some time. But a new init standard was long overdue and if distros can finally rally around systemd it might be worth it.)

Re: CentOS 7 released on x86_64

#65

Post by 3h8d »

netcraft wrote: post #26
cwyers wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It looks like the listed minimum for RHEL 6 was 1gb[1]. I don't think 128 was officially supported even then, so if you're happy with how it works now, you may still be happy with 7. 1) http://www.slac.stanford.edu/comp/unix/linux/install_RHEL6.h...

The installer requires 406mb of ram to work: http://wiki.centos.org/Manuals/ReleaseNotes/CentOS7#head-281...

Would it be possible to assign swap to a removable media device and then bootstrap the installer to run in that environment on a device with 128mb?

Re: CentOS 7 released on x86_64

#66

Post by noselasd »

3h8d wrote: post #65
netcraft wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The installer requires 406mb of ram to work: http://wiki.centos.org/Manuals/ReleaseNotes/CentOS7#head-281...

Would it be possible to assign swap to a removable media device and then bootstrap the installer to run in that environment on a device with 128mb?

Probably. You'll have to hack the install procedure to enable swapping before it's being run though.

If you're serious about trying this, the fastest path is to install CentOS in a VM on a suitable machine that isn't going to spend a day in the installer swapping like crazy, and copy the image to a physical drive which you eventually stuff into the ancient low memory box.

Re: CentOS 7 released on x86_64

#67

Post by tene »

jfindley wrote: post #39
jrslack wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Oh, an embedded HTTP server is loaded to read them. QR codes are served, as well. And outright falsehoods. systemd-journald-gatewayd is entirely optional. People keep harping on a packaging mistake when it was first pushed to Fedora for testing, but repeating it so many times doesn't make it true. >In fact, udev merged with systemd a long time ago systemd relies on udev and dbus, but udev doesn't pull in systemd as…

I'd be very interested to see a qualified crypto expert on the "sealing" that journald uses. This is one of two indicators of a troubling level of arrogance from the developers. The crypto method used by journald to verify messages haven't been tampered with is called Forward Secure Sealing [0]. It's based on an invention of the brother of Lennart - the lead developer, and for a long time after first release even the…

I just can't agree with your [2] as a problem. The actual problem (an assertion failure in systemd) was fixed, several alternative workarounds are provided in case the user can't or doesn't want to upgrade systemd immediately, and functionality changes about when and where and how to log were going on on the mailing list, as they should be, and the reporters were directed there politely, even after violent vitriolic attacks. After discussion concluded on the mailing list, systemd was changed to direct debug logs away from kmsg as soon as journald is available.

I can't find anything to complain about from the systemd team on that bug report. I'd just dismiss it as varying personal standards of politeness, but the complaints on that bug report are themselves far far worse, with vitriolic abuse and death threats, so there's got to be something else going on here.

Re: CentOS 7 released on x86_64

#68

Post by voltagex_ »

sliverstorm wrote: post #20
topbanana wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are quite a few choices of lightweight Linux distro. This isn't aimed at that market

Oh, I know, but I've been happily using CentOS 6 on my 128MB box, and was looking forward to CentOS 7.

When I'm building tiny Debian images, I use debootstrap, which doesn't seem to use much RAM at all.

There used to be a Fedora equivalent called febootstrap, but it looks like it's mutated a bit since then: http://people.redhat.com/~rjones/supermin/

You may be able to work around it that way.

Out of interest, what machine are you using CentOS 6 on? I find 128mb kinda tight - although I've recently found a VPS provider who's managed to get Debian Jessie working in 96!

Re: CentOS 7 released on x86_64

#69

Post by Hello71 »

jfindley wrote: post #39
jrslack wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Oh, an embedded HTTP server is loaded to read them. QR codes are served, as well. And outright falsehoods. systemd-journald-gatewayd is entirely optional. People keep harping on a packaging mistake when it was first pushed to Fedora for testing, but repeating it so many times doesn't make it true. >In fact, udev merged with systemd a long time ago systemd relies on udev and dbus, but udev doesn't pull in systemd as…

I'd be very interested to see a qualified crypto expert on the "sealing" that journald uses. This is one of two indicators of a troubling level of arrogance from the developers. The crypto method used by journald to verify messages haven't been tampered with is called Forward Secure Sealing [0]. It's based on an invention of the brother of Lennart - the lead developer, and for a long time after first release even the…

all I got from [2] is "if you would like to have productive discussion, move to the mailing list. if not, prepare to be banned."

Re: CentOS 7 released on x86_64

#70

Post by sliverstorm »

voltagex_ wrote: post #68
sliverstorm wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, I know, but I've been happily using CentOS 6 on my 128MB box, and was looking forward to CentOS 7.

When I'm building tiny Debian images, I use debootstrap, which doesn't seem to use much RAM at all. There used to be a Fedora equivalent called febootstrap, but it looks like it's mutated a bit since then: http://people.redhat.com/~rjones/supermin/ You may be able to work around it that way. Out of interest, what machine are you using CentOS 6 on? I find 128mb kinda tight - although I've recently found a VPS provider…

BuyVM, $15/year

The good news is BuyVM just announced they are preparing a CentOS 7 image, so the installer RAM limit may not matter.

You are right that 128mb is a bit tight, I have problems with some services that just gobble memory. Apache+PHP are terrible in that regard.

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