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Tinder's Forgotten Woman: Whitney Wolfe, Sexism, and Startup Creation Myths

businessweek.com

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Re: Tinder's Forgotten Woman: Whitney Wolfe, Sexism, and Startup Creation Myths

#61

Post by pbhjpbhj »

rayiner wrote: post #7

The "Tinderslut"[1] comment says a lot about how Rad and Mateen view the women who use their app. It's consistent with Wolfe's claim in her complaint that Mateen told her it would be "slutty" to be a female Tinder co-founder, because it was an app people used to hook up. As an aside, Mateen exhibits the textbook Madonna-whore dichotomy. To him, women are either someone he can see being a wife (Wolfe pre-breakup), or…

>says a lot about how Rad and Mateen view the women who use their app //

Isn't the point of the app to enable promiscuity. "Slut" is a word for a promiscuous woman, sometimes used for a prostitute, sometimes used of men (in UK at least). Surely they viewed the women who use the app as wanting to have free and easy sexual encounters, ie behave like sluts?

When the slang that associated their app with the actions of those using it, viz "tinderslut", was popularised were they not justified to consider that an achievement - the app was clearly notorious for enabling promiscuous behaviour, exactly the behaviour it was designed for.

There seems little controversial in them calling active users of their app sluts (men or women).

For me there is much to hate about the app morally but it seems rather silly to get upset that the designers of the app that people use to seek out promiscuous sex consider their users to be in to promiscuous sex?!

Re: Tinder's Forgotten Woman: Whitney Wolfe, Sexism, and Startup Creation Myths

#62

Post by robg »

dang wrote: post #54
dbloom wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It looks like the URL of the article has an alternative (older?) headline in it: http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2014-07-02/tinders-forg... "Tinder's Forgotten Woman: Whitney Wolfe, Sexism, and Startup Creation Myths"

Ah yes, the "extract alternative title from URL" trick. My title fu is failing me, though. Is this one really better?

I think so, it's certainly more descriptive of what's contained therein.

EDIT: The generic "women" in the current title is certainly more misleading and may be contributing to the penalty being assessed by those who haven't read the piece. The article only discusses one woman.

Re: Tinder's Forgotten Woman: Whitney Wolfe, Sexism, and Startup Creation Myths

#63

Post by serge2k »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #61
rayiner wrote: post #7

The "Tinderslut"[1] comment says a lot about how Rad and Mateen view the women who use their app. It's consistent with Wolfe's claim in her complaint that Mateen told her it would be "slutty" to be a female Tinder co-founder, because it was an app people used to hook up. As an aside, Mateen exhibits the textbook Madonna-whore dichotomy. To him, women are either someone he can see being a wife (Wolfe pre-breakup), or…

> says a lot about how Rad and Mateen view the women who use their app // Isn't the point of the app to enable promiscuity. "Slut" is a word for a promiscuous woman, sometimes used for a prostitute, sometimes used of men (in UK at least). Surely they viewed the women who use the app as wanting to have free and easy sexual encounters, ie behave like sluts? When the slang that associated their app with the actions of t…

Why is this much to hate about this app morally?

Re: Tinder's Forgotten Woman: Whitney Wolfe, Sexism, and Startup Creation Myths

#64

Post by jedanbik »

protonfish wrote: post #28
jpeg_hero wrote: post #21

So they were dating? IAC is screwed. Dating an direct report is essentially sexual harassment in the eyes of the court. I am adding "anti-fraternization" policy to my employee handbook today. Seriously, does anybody know how to handle the hr on discovering a supervisor / direct report are dating? I've been told that best practices is to immediately suggest one or the other resign, and if they don't, fire both for vio…

I seriously doubt having an "anti-fraternization" policy in your handbook will do anything prevent sexist harassment.

It's better than nothing. It's better than literally nothing.

Re: Tinder's Forgotten Woman: Whitney Wolfe, Sexism, and Startup Creation Myths

#65

Post by olefoo »

randyrand wrote: post #59
ColinCera wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Dating an direct report is essentially sexual harassment in the eyes of the court. That's not even remotely true. No court has ever held that merely dating a subordinate is ipso facto sexual harassment. Accordingly, many companies do not have an official policy against it.

You're right, but this area is so incredibly gray it might as well be one in the same. Sexual harassment laws were not created with relationships in mind, but co-workers. I have the opposite opinion in that I think that sexual harassment cases involving exes in the work place should almost always be thrown out, but alas... It's nearly impossibly to date someone and not sexually harass them in some way. It's doubly ha…

> considering many people call significant others very bad things when they are breaking up,

I've been around the block a few times and had a few past relationships go sour; but I've never felt the need to call an ex-lover a slut or suggest that she was a whore for sleeping with someone other than me. If someone does that, I'm going to judge them; and not in a good light.

Re: Tinder's Forgotten Woman: Whitney Wolfe, Sexism, and Startup Creation Myths

#66

Post by mrjaeger »

tzs wrote: post #60

> She says that Mateen, whom she dated ...and now I have no reason to believe either her allegations or his defenses. People are simply unreliable witnesses in matters concerning former romantic partners that they are not on good terms with.

Except that there are explicitly documented text messages of him doing exactly what she described http://www.businessinsider.com/tinder-lawsuit-and-sexual-har...

Re: Tinder's Forgotten Woman: Whitney Wolfe, Sexism, and Startup Creation Myths

#67

Post by potatolicious »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #61
rayiner wrote: post #7

The "Tinderslut"[1] comment says a lot about how Rad and Mateen view the women who use their app. It's consistent with Wolfe's claim in her complaint that Mateen told her it would be "slutty" to be a female Tinder co-founder, because it was an app people used to hook up. As an aside, Mateen exhibits the textbook Madonna-whore dichotomy. To him, women are either someone he can see being a wife (Wolfe pre-breakup), or…

> says a lot about how Rad and Mateen view the women who use their app // Isn't the point of the app to enable promiscuity. "Slut" is a word for a promiscuous woman, sometimes used for a prostitute, sometimes used of men (in UK at least). Surely they viewed the women who use the app as wanting to have free and easy sexual encounters, ie behave like sluts? When the slang that associated their app with the actions of t…

"Slut" is a derogatory term, it has connotations and meanings well beyond the most literal definition of "promiscuous person".

Calling Tinder user "sluts" is no more appropriate than calling my Chinese users "chinks", or my gay users "faggots".

It seems intentionally obtuse to pretend that the term doesn't have a gigantic truckload of derogatory connotations behind it.

Re: Tinder's Forgotten Woman: Whitney Wolfe, Sexism, and Startup Creation Myths

#68

Post by rhizome »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #61
rayiner wrote: post #7

The "Tinderslut"[1] comment says a lot about how Rad and Mateen view the women who use their app. It's consistent with Wolfe's claim in her complaint that Mateen told her it would be "slutty" to be a female Tinder co-founder, because it was an app people used to hook up. As an aside, Mateen exhibits the textbook Madonna-whore dichotomy. To him, women are either someone he can see being a wife (Wolfe pre-breakup), or…

> says a lot about how Rad and Mateen view the women who use their app // Isn't the point of the app to enable promiscuity. "Slut" is a word for a promiscuous woman, sometimes used for a prostitute, sometimes used of men (in UK at least). Surely they viewed the women who use the app as wanting to have free and easy sexual encounters, ie behave like sluts? When the slang that associated their app with the actions of t…

So, what would you say is the word for a man who uses Tinder often, a word that would make sense to the greatest proportion of people, i.e. not "slut," which you acknowledge is relatively rarely used to refer to men?

Re: Tinder's Forgotten Woman: Whitney Wolfe, Sexism, and Startup Creation Myths

#69

Post by sanswork »

randyrand wrote: post #59
ColinCera wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Dating an direct report is essentially sexual harassment in the eyes of the court. That's not even remotely true. No court has ever held that merely dating a subordinate is ipso facto sexual harassment. Accordingly, many companies do not have an official policy against it.

You're right, but this area is so incredibly gray it might as well be one in the same. Sexual harassment laws were not created with relationships in mind, but co-workers. I have the opposite opinion in that I think that sexual harassment cases involving exes in the work place should almost always be thrown out, but alas... It's nearly impossibly to date someone and not sexually harass them in some way. It's doubly ha…

>It's nearly impossibly to date someone and not sexually harass them in some way

You have horrible relationships if you think this is even remotely true.

> It's doubly hard to break up with someone and not sexually harass them in some way.

And even worse break ups.

That or you don't know what sexual harassment is which I'm thinking is far more likely.

>it's almost impossible to draw the line between sexual harassment and break-up banter.

No its not.

Re: Tinder's Forgotten Woman: Whitney Wolfe, Sexism, and Startup Creation Myths

#70

Post by hueving »

potatolicious wrote: post #67
pbhjpbhj wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> says a lot about how Rad and Mateen view the women who use their app // Isn't the point of the app to enable promiscuity. "Slut" is a word for a promiscuous woman, sometimes used for a prostitute, sometimes used of men (in UK at least). Surely they viewed the women who use the app as wanting to have free and easy sexual encounters, ie behave like sluts? When the slang that associated their app with the actions of t…

"Slut" is a derogatory term, it has connotations and meanings well beyond the most literal definition of "promiscuous person". Calling Tinder user "sluts" is no more appropriate than calling my Chinese users "chinks", or my gay users "faggots". It seems intentionally obtuse to pretend that the term doesn't have a gigantic truckload of derogatory connotations behind it.

What are the negative connotations? I thought the only reason it was considered a bad term was purely because it was considered bad 60 years ago for a woman to be promiscuous. I.e. The insult was calling them promiscuous.
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