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Make-A-Wish Foundation Turns San Francisco Into Gotham for 5-Year-Old Batkid

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Re: Make-A-Wish Foundation Turns San Francisco Into Gotham for 5-Year-Old Batkid

#61

Post by hershel »

rwallace wrote: post #54
mark_integerdsv wrote: post #16

I really felt some strong emotions while reading through this. It's amazing. The news spot just has to the the cherry on top. So happy for this kid that he had an awesome day. It does restore some faith in humanity to see things like this. ...however... I hate myself for being the contrarian in this case but as a South African and having worked with one or two NGOs that work with sick people in general, including kid…

Judging an act by its consequences seems like a frightfully hard-nosed, rational thing to do; the problem with trying to put it into practice is that we tend to end up judging only by the superficially obvious consequences and ignoring the more important long-term effects. It's easy to compare the nominal cost of this event with the idea that it only helped one person, but the latter isn't actually true; it obviously…

>> it obviously brightened the lives of thousands of people, and not just with shallow entertainment but with the opportunity to lift their gazes from the mud and look at the sky, to reflect for a moment on their place in the world. I have no idea how to calculate the benefit from that, but it wouldn't surprise me if it greatly outweighed the cost.

But we don't know if it had a positive effect. Maybe it had a negative effect? Maybe people will donate and volunteer less to other causes ? Maybe we are replacing valuable charity with fun charity ? Those are all valid options.

And because this affected so many people , the cumulative effect would be a big negative ?

It's hard to fully predict the result of our actions. Life is complex as you say.But that's beside the point.

The point is: thousands of people having a good time, while believing they did something great, while doing very little in reality.

Re: Make-A-Wish Foundation Turns San Francisco Into Gotham for 5-Year-Old Batkid

#62

Post by derefr »

hershel wrote: post #38
derefr wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's a lens that might be helpful to view this through: seeing these kinds of personal, touching results encourages philanthropy--we're "spending money to make money," so to speak. We just need to channel that generated emotion and desire-to-help through the cold, calculating hands of organizations like GiveWell. :)

Another interpretation could be: "we did out part, we helped batkid. No need to donate/volunteer/etc" There's a similar thing called in internet activism , where people who upvote/like and comment don't go and be really politically active, in a politically meaningful way.

I wonder whether seeing a story where something good happened that you didn't have a (rationalizable) part in, still triggers the effect. If it did, you'd think aid organizations would A/B-test call-ins to their telethons and realize that they should stop showing the happy kids that've already been helped.

Re: Make-A-Wish Foundation Turns San Francisco Into Gotham for 5-Year-Old Batkid

#63

Post by corysama »

dbaupp wrote: post #33
tn13 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whenever I meet someone who asks for donations in the name of sick kids I politely refuse. I am always skeptical as to where that money actually goes. But when I read this report I am willing to donate more money to this organization. The story is not just heartwarming it has served number of purposes. I got to know more about the disease, the organizations involved and most importantly it has motivated me to give mo…

> But when I read this report I am willing to donate more money to this organization. At the risk of being overly cynical, and putting words into mark_integerdsv's mouth, I believe that's almost exactly what he's arguing against. Make-a-wish spends $7.5k on each wish on average[1]. Whereas something like Schistosomiasis Control Initiative per-child cost is $5[2]. That is, the money spent "granting wishes" could perfo…

True, it's not optimal. But, it's important to keep in mind that this is not a zero-sum game. The $7500 is not being diverted or even distracted from more efficient uses. It's money that in all likelihood would have never been donated to other uses.

We need a lot more of both ends of this spectrum. More warm fuzzies to get people's attention -at all. And, more awareness of the wildly different efficiencies of different philanthropic strategies. Achieving both attention and efficiency is really hard. If you figure out how to do that, let me know. In the mean time, we should be happy for whatever wins we can get.

Re: Make-A-Wish Foundation Turns San Francisco Into Gotham for 5-Year-Old Batkid

#65

Post by doorhammer »

cia_plant wrote: post #60

I clicked the comment link for this story just to see how HN readers would make this simple feel-good story into some cynical circle-jerk. Was not disappointed.

Seconded

I did see some cheery responses that were nice, though. So there's at least a little hope.

Re: Make-A-Wish Foundation Turns San Francisco Into Gotham for 5-Year-Old Batkid

#66

Post by bnegreve »

cia_plant wrote: post #60

I clicked the comment link for this story just to see how HN readers would make this simple feel-good story into some cynical circle-jerk. Was not disappointed.

I just read the comments, some people like it, some other discuss whether it really makes sens. What's wrong with that?

Re: Make-A-Wish Foundation Turns San Francisco Into Gotham for 5-Year-Old Batkid

#67

Post by mark_integerdsv »

cia_plant wrote: post #60

I clicked the comment link for this story just to see how HN readers would make this simple feel-good story into some cynical circle-jerk. Was not disappointed.

My comment would almost certainly be one that you are referring to.

I think you need to justify how it is a cynical comment please?

To me, the truly cynical thing here is that you can't seem to understand that Batkid's entire life is a lot more comfortable and pleasant than that of a great number of sick children around the world.

The fact that so much that could have gone so far was spent on making an already (relatively) privileged existence fun for a day because of the air time it generates - is hideously cynical.

I really do not wish to be overdoing the guilt trip here, I'm just a little baffled by your definition of cynicism.

Re: Make-A-Wish Foundation Turns San Francisco Into Gotham for 5-Year-Old Batkid

#68

Post by chris_wot »

alan_cx wrote: post #46
chris_wot wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bruce Wayne had it covered.

Perhaps "Bruce Wayne's" money might have been better spent in providing base line care and medical research to the benefit of many, rather than spending it on a big PR stunt.

Many, many people benefitted from this.

Re: Make-A-Wish Foundation Turns San Francisco Into Gotham for 5-Year-Old Batkid

#69

Post by cududa »

hershel wrote: post #35
cududa wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are you talking about? "What we don't want to fix though, are the real causes of the problems" I'm pretty sure a crap ton of people are working on solving "the problem" aka cancer. The world is filled with shitty things, can't people create the occasional extraordinary experience/ scenario just to make people feel good?

If you look at statistics for access for cancer care for people with low income, you'll probably find enough places to put this money and effort into with better impact. But that's boring.

People are also working on bringing cheaper care to people who can't currently afford it. Plus, this event was organized almost entirely for free.

Re: Make-A-Wish Foundation Turns San Francisco Into Gotham for 5-Year-Old Batkid

#70

Post by tn13 »

dbaupp wrote: post #33
tn13 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Whenever I meet someone who asks for donations in the name of sick kids I politely refuse. I am always skeptical as to where that money actually goes. But when I read this report I am willing to donate more money to this organization. The story is not just heartwarming it has served number of purposes. I got to know more about the disease, the organizations involved and most importantly it has motivated me to give mo…

> But when I read this report I am willing to donate more money to this organization. At the risk of being overly cynical, and putting words into mark_integerdsv's mouth, I believe that's almost exactly what he's arguing against. Make-a-wish spends $7.5k on each wish on average[1]. Whereas something like Schistosomiasis Control Initiative per-child cost is $5[2]. That is, the money spent "granting wishes" could perfo…

I do not think the said organization is working in the area of "Schistosomiasis Control Initiative". They are working in a different area and it is good thing that they have money to spend. May be it is much easier to ask for money for leukemia than for "Schistosomiasis Control Initiative".

I dont think the said organization is optimizing for overall child health care. They are optimizing it for a particular area.

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