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Pushed to the limit as a banking intern

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Pushed to the limit as a banking intern

#61

Post by michalu »

cliveowen wrote: post #6

This is all really, really wrong. I wonder how we, as a society, have managed to lower our values this much. Working days and nights and for what? Even if you do become rich, then what? You can't have your health back and you wasted years of your life chasing a dream. When you're on the patio of your beach house with your high blood pressure, anxiety and depression, what have you accomplished? Is reality like the dre…

"for what?" I don't think you are a measure of what is meaningful for other person and what's not. If I choose to work 12 hours it's my free choice, not affecting you, and I may have my own reasons. If I don't want to do so I will find another job. If there are more capable people like me employers will have to change conditions to attract talent. But I won't modify my reasons to other peoples ideas about what is meaningful and what is not.

Re: Pushed to the limit as a banking intern

#62

Post by kenster07 »

jmduke wrote: post #18
cliveowen wrote: post #6

This is all really, really wrong. I wonder how we, as a society, have managed to lower our values this much. Working days and nights and for what? Even if you do become rich, then what? You can't have your health back and you wasted years of your life chasing a dream. When you're on the patio of your beach house with your high blood pressure, anxiety and depression, what have you accomplished? Is reality like the dre…

Was it intentional or unintentional that your comment also describes the life of entrepreneurs/startup founders?

The article described a life where interns basically stayed up for no reason.

And if an entrepreneur is regularly pulling all-nighters for no good reason, he is probably doing it wrong. Sleep is worth its weight in gold, and you don't give it up for anything less.

Re: Pushed to the limit as a banking intern

#63

Post by consultant23522 »

yogo wrote: post #22
bambax wrote: post #11

> Lots and lots of people, particularly Americans, will use Adderall, Ritalin and Modafinil. I don't understand. Are we supposed to feel sorry for them?

Naively when I see a job ad asking for a rockstar programmer I assume there will be a supply of coke :P. Asking for a ninja... well that doesn't seem as much fun.

I had a gig once where the manager pulled us into a meeting and with a straight face told that in order to finish this project on time (really a week early) we were expected to work 12 hour days and be on call. If we got a call and had to respond we were still expected to come in and work the 12 hour shift. I politely raised my hand and with a straight face asked if the company health benefits would include meth-amphetamines.

Re: Pushed to the limit as a banking intern

#64

Post by ApertureHour »

michalu wrote: post #61
cliveowen wrote: post #6

This is all really, really wrong. I wonder how we, as a society, have managed to lower our values this much. Working days and nights and for what? Even if you do become rich, then what? You can't have your health back and you wasted years of your life chasing a dream. When you're on the patio of your beach house with your high blood pressure, anxiety and depression, what have you accomplished? Is reality like the dre…

"for what?" I don't think you are a measure of what is meaningful for other person and what's not. If I choose to work 12 hours it's my free choice, not affecting you, and I may have my own reasons. If I don't want to do so I will find another job. If there are more capable people like me employers will have to change conditions to attract talent. But I won't modify my reasons to other peoples ideas about what is mea…

I think part of the complaint is not that people have different goals and motivations for doing things; it's that they often engage in behaviour that is actively counter-productive to achieving their stated aims.

Re: Pushed to the limit as a banking intern

#65

Post by 7952 »

mordae wrote: post #40

It's sad when the brightest and most competent people end up treated like that, but when they are abused and used against the rest, it's when I start feeling like putting up a guillotine.

I think its sad when anyone is treated like this, and pretending that some people are different with "best and brightest" bullshit just makes things all the worse.

Re: Pushed to the limit as a banking intern

#66

Post by kenster07 »

jackgavigan wrote: post #48

When Google was a young company, she worked 130 hours per week and often slept at her desk. "For my first five years at Google, I pulled an all-nighter every week," Mayer said in a recent talk at New York's 92Y cultural center. "It was a lot of hard work." Source: http://www.entrepreneur.com/blog/223723

Businesspeople exaggerate and even outright lie all the time. You should always keep a grain of salt around.

Re: Pushed to the limit as a banking intern

#67

Post by michalu »

ApertureHour wrote: post #64
michalu wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"for what?" I don't think you are a measure of what is meaningful for other person and what's not. If I choose to work 12 hours it's my free choice, not affecting you, and I may have my own reasons. If I don't want to do so I will find another job. If there are more capable people like me employers will have to change conditions to attract talent. But I won't modify my reasons to other peoples ideas about what is mea…

I think part of the complaint is not that people have different goals and motivations for doing things; it's that they often engage in behaviour that is actively counter-productive to achieving their stated aims.

I agree with you, many peoples acts are not in harmony with their values but I am not sure society can solve this in an effective way, without imposing limits. If your acts are not crossing the boundaries of another's rights then in my opinion as long as you have options to make a change then this battle is for everyone to win by themselves.

Re: Pushed to the limit as a banking intern

#68

Post by gpvos »

rayiner wrote: post #29
cliveowen wrote: post #6

This is all really, really wrong. I wonder how we, as a society, have managed to lower our values this much. Working days and nights and for what? Even if you do become rich, then what? You can't have your health back and you wasted years of your life chasing a dream. When you're on the patio of your beach house with your high blood pressure, anxiety and depression, what have you accomplished? Is reality like the dre…

So the article is describing investment banking, which is particularly demanding because it's a service job. You're helping a client do a deal, and clients are demanding and deals are time-sensitive. People generally do not go into investment banking expecting to make a career out of it. A few-year stint as an analyst is a great way to get into HBS/GSB/Wharton, and from there into a CFO-track position at an F500. It'…

All that doesn't make it any less wrong.

Re: Pushed to the limit as a banking intern

#69

Post by rayiner »

coolnow wrote: post #31
jmduke wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Was it intentional or unintentional that your comment also describes the life of entrepreneurs/startup founders?

Through a startup, most times at least you can say you provided a service (like Dropbox). With banking, you're pretty much a devil in a lot of people's eyes and you're working purely for the profit of your employer.

Silicon valley types are the devil to the unwashed San Francisco hippies. As an investment banker you also provide a service. When Google buys a startup for $50 million, that transaction doesn't make itself happen.

Re: Pushed to the limit as a banking intern

#70

Post by Jacqued »

DanBC wrote: post #59
harryh wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It might sound wrong to you, but that's fine. You can do something else. There are plenty of people who love working in banking with this sort of culture (and the financial rewards it brings). There's nothing wrong with different people having different goals.

It is clear that perverse incentives exist in some industries, and that those industries have failed to self-regulate. They now need regulation forced upon them. Luckily, in the UK, we have the European Working Times directive, and so interns should not feel forced to work 70 continuous hours.

The problem lies not in the rules, but in their enforcement.

I can't speak for the UK but in France it is not allowed for an intern to work more than 40 hours a week under any circumstances, yet in many industries you still see 60+h workweeks as a standard for interns...

Because by any means, an intern subject to this kind of unacceptable working conditions will not speak up since that would annihilate his chances to get a job at the end of his internship (and might even discredit him at other companies in the same industry)

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