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I'm 23, An Entrepreneur, and Fucking Terrified.

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Re: I'm 23, An Entrepreneur, and Fucking Terrified.

#61

Post by mindcrime »

mathattack wrote: post #34
prawks wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To back up your point, in what world is having a good job, nice house, and large retirement savings "mediocre"?

When you come from the country club life (first paragraph) it is indeed mediocre. I'll toss in the counterpoint that having kids that are thrilled to see you, even if you live in a tiny apartment, is anything but mediocre. The OP seems to have a lot of priorities out of whack.

To back up your point, in what world is having a good job, nice house, and large retirement savings "mediocre"? reply

When you come from the country club life (first paragraph) it is indeed mediocre.

I would consider that mediocre as well, and I grew up about as far from "country club" life as you can get. As in, dirt-poor, below-the-poverty-line, white-trash from rural southeastern NC.

Of course, some of that is that we constantly raise the bar for ourselves (well, I do anyway). Maybe the scenario above would have sounded like heaven to me when I was 20, but it doesn't now. Just the "job" part gives me the creeps. I, for one, don't want a traditional "job" at all. My standard of the line between mediocre life and successful life involves a big element of being able to control my own fate to a greater degree, and some ability to call my own shots. Translated, that means running a company I own, not working for somebody else.

The OP seems to have a lot of priorities out of whack.

Meh. Who are we to judge? A person's priorities are their priorities... there is no "right" or "wrong" on this.

Re: I'm 23, An Entrepreneur, and Fucking Terrified.

#62

Post by mjhea0 »

adeptus wrote: post #33

You wrote all that at 23? You should be writing for a living! Forget code, write in English.

i agree - the writing is amazing. you did such a great job of conveying a lot of what i feel on a daily basis. i'm 30, and i work freelance. i rarely sleep. very little social life. it amazes me on a daily basis that i somehow still have friends - and a girlfriend - considering how much i neglect those around me in favor of doing what i love. where is the balance? i, too, want a wife and kids someday.

anyhow, great piece. as long as you can live another day, the opportunity is there for something big to happen. i've gone from the lowest of lows to the highest of highs in a matter of a few hours.

perhaps reframing what success really is would help. i know how hard that can be, though. take it easy on yourself. not many people can do what you're doing. measuring yourself to those living a so-called "normal" lifestyle is unfair to yourself. you've chosen a different path, a path that, believe me, many would love but are too scared to make.

Re: I'm 23, An Entrepreneur, and Fucking Terrified.

#63

Post by BWStearns »

untog wrote: post #17

I don't like judging people based on their age. It seems like a really blunt instrument that unfairly groups people together who do not belong there. But as someone who is only just pushing 30, I can say that you are talking the same kind of nonsense I did in my early 20s. "To all of the people who say that the best thing to do is get a good job, buy a nice house, and to put the max into a 401k that the company will…

>> Take a job as a developer. You'll make good money. Make sure it isn't for a demanding startup. Something that guarantees exiting the office at 5pm every day

I have not worked in a developer shop yet, so this may not translate over, but in any of my other jobs (which were stable and not for startups) the idea of leaving the office at 5pm was ridiculous most of the time. Even if I did manage it, nothing stopped a 8pm email from giving me 2 more hours of work. Same with going on vacation, especially if you're the only one in a company who has a certain skill.

The 9-5 itself is dead and competition mandates working hard. Not startup hard, but not 1960's stereotype clock punching easy. When you look at it that way, why not put a year or four into playing a lottery that you can actually influence the outcome of?

>> You are not a unique butterfly that is owed the opportunity to only ever do exactly what you want.

Plenty agreed, and while I legitimately appreciate the snark/slight Fight Club reference, where did he say he is owed the opportunity? I believe he stated that whether given or earned he has the opportunity. There was no normative judgement on how he came about it other than guilt for it not being more austere.

Edit: grammar.

Re: I'm 23, An Entrepreneur, and Fucking Terrified.

#64

Post by mindcrime »

sailfast wrote: post #43
mathattack wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you come from the country club life (first paragraph) it is indeed mediocre. I'll toss in the counterpoint that having kids that are thrilled to see you, even if you live in a tiny apartment, is anything but mediocre. The OP seems to have a lot of priorities out of whack.

Agreed. As a new father, having the chance to go home at a reasonable hour and have your kids smile at you can be a significant benefit that one would gladly take over increased compensation or options.

This is probably the biggest question mark I have about my own choices. I've chosen to live my life focused on achieving my vision of a "not mediocre" life, and I've sacrificed a lot of things along the way: settling down, getting married, having kids, etc.

So when I go home and visit my friends, and watch them playing with their kids and kissing their wives, etc., there's always a pang of regret that says "you could have gone this route instead". But, of course, as they say "the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence", blah, blah.

But I never wanted to start a family until I was in a position to give them the kind of life that I would want them to have.

Anyway, getting married and doing all that is potentially still in the cards. Time will tell, I suppose.

Re: I'm 23, An Entrepreneur, and Fucking Terrified.

#66

Post by mindcrime »

mgkimsal wrote: post #52
fennecfoxen wrote: post #35

"To all of the people who say that the best thing to do is get a good job, buy a nice house, and to put the max into a 401k that the company will match: Fuck you. It’s not what I want. Mediocrity is worse than failure." Hey, man, if that's not what you want, that's cool and all, but I'm just going to defend myself and my buddies with good jobs and stuffed 401(k)s: There are other things besides Business that matter t…

More to the point, most 'wantrepreneurs' rely on customers being in the middle class or higher, and having discretionary incomes from their stuffed 401ks to spend on their product/service/Saas/etc. To call that lifestyle 'mediocrity' and insult the very people that you need to grow your business is beyond the pale. Just wait until he starts hiring people. He'll need those people who are satisfied when their work life…

To call that lifestyle 'mediocrity' and insult the very people that you need to grow your business is beyond the pale.

FWIW, I think "mediocre" is relative and very personal. A stable job, a modest house, a 401(k) with some money in it, etc., would be mediocre for me, because that just isn't what I want. But I would never argue that it's mediocre in any universal or objective sense. Whether someone's life is mediocre or not is entirely relative to their ambitions, goals, and priorities.

So if you ever hear me describe that kind of life as mediocre, know that that only means it isn't the kind of life I aspire to.

In fact, I go home sometimes to visit my best friend... he works as an over the road truck driver, doesn't make a ton of money, has a modest home, etc., but has a great wife and three kids. I would never call his life mediocre, and I'm even jealous in certain regards at times. I'll even be the first to say that he has accomplished more than I have in a lot of ways, while I'm off chasing entrepreneurial dreams and big ambitions.

Silicon Valley startup porn is harmful to many people

No doubt. But for some of us, it's not just "I want to be rich". I mean, I joke about a lot of things (search for my old posts here mentioning the word 'Maserati' for example), but the real driver for me is the need to be free. I want to run my own company and have plenty of money, just for the degree of freedom that entails. I can't stand the idea of having a "boss" in the traditional sense, somebody who can come in and order me around and keep me under his thumb. I want "FU money" because I want the freedom to say "FU" and go do what I want to do. But that's just a reflection of my self-centered, radical individualist, libertarian nature.

Re: I'm 23, An Entrepreneur, and Fucking Terrified.

#67

Post by brianbreslin »

A lot of times I wonder if people become entrepreneurs because they think its this fun lifestyle? Or do they think its an instant path to riches? Or do they fear a 9-5 job? Or are they doing it for the reason I do it: to create something?

Psychologists could have a field day with entrepreneurs.

Re: I'm 23, An Entrepreneur, and Fucking Terrified.

#68

Post by frenchy »

niuzeta wrote: post #37
ironchef wrote: post #9

What's wrong with 9 to 5ing, learning more, and doing your own thing on your own time for a while. There's NOTHING wrong with that. Don't buy into the romantic notion that you have to give 110% to your startup or it's not worth doing. Pragmatism is ok. Pragmatism is not mediocrity. Don't confuse the two. There's a lot of hyperbole and rhetoric in the startup world. Don't buy into it. Plenty of startups have been laun…

I am young, just out of university, had a passion for writing, did a major-cs-minor-literature. Now I do 9 to 5, and write after work. Life is good for me and I am happy because I love my work and after-work. The purist obsession that you need to be 100% devoted to something is beyond me, but like I said, I am happy and know that I am happy because I knew this would make me happy. The OP has a different opinion of ha…

It's not so much his opinion of happiness, but his looking-down on other opinions of happiness.

Re: I'm 23, An Entrepreneur, and Fucking Terrified.

#69

Post by mathattack »

davidjgraph wrote: post #40
mathattack wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you come from the country club life (first paragraph) it is indeed mediocre. I'll toss in the counterpoint that having kids that are thrilled to see you, even if you live in a tiny apartment, is anything but mediocre. The OP seems to have a lot of priorities out of whack.

> The OP seems to have a lot of priorities out of whack. Hands up everyone who had their priorities in life sorted by the of 23? (Mine is down).

Point taken. :-) Mine is down too.

Re: I'm 23, An Entrepreneur, and Fucking Terrified.

#70

Post by mathattack »

mindcrime wrote: post #64
sailfast wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. As a new father, having the chance to go home at a reasonable hour and have your kids smile at you can be a significant benefit that one would gladly take over increased compensation or options.

This is probably the biggest question mark I have about my own choices. I've chosen to live my life focused on achieving my vision of a "not mediocre" life, and I've sacrificed a lot of things along the way: settling down, getting married, having kids, etc. So when I go home and visit my friends, and watch them playing with their kids and kissing their wives, etc., there's always a pang of regret that says "you could…

Never too old, and best to wait until you're ready. Just like not everyone is ready to do a start-up today, not everyone is ready for kids today. Better to be mentally and financially prepared. But if you do an even halfway decent job as a parent, your kids won't care how rich their parents are.
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