Obama Promises Disappear from Web • Hacker News Board

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#61

Post by lukifer » Fri, Jul 26, 2013, 5:37 AM UTC

jivatmanx wrote: post #13

mtgx wrote: post #10

You know, ending the mass surveilling would be a huge achievement on its own (probably by repealing the Patriot Act and the FISA Amendments Act) - but what I'd really like is to get so much support from the people and the Congress, to eventually impeach him. Now that would remain in history, and would teach future presidents a lesson about overextending themselves with the spying. Obviously people like Alexander, Cla…

Alexander is an extremely powerful, dangerous man. His removal should first priority.

While I agree, is there any reason to expect different behavior from a replacement?

Even scarier than a single corrupt tyrant, or even a cabal of "shadow government" figures, is the possibility that these institutions have taken on a life of their own, independent from any one actor.

http://omniorthogonal.blogspot.com/2013/02/hostile-ai-youre-...

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#62

Post by true_religion » Fri, Jul 26, 2013, 5:43 AM UTC

lukifer wrote: post #59

true_religion wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious. What's un-American about it? I can see the whole "un-internet" aspect, becuase after all "cool urls don't change", but un-American?

In theory, the shared narrative of America is rooted in Enlightenment values, including a respect for reason, education and history. The lack of a proactive attempt to preserve that history, let alone to erase it intentionally, goes against the principles of the Age of Reason. In practice, obviously, this story is at best an ideal we strive for, and that we only achieve partially or intermittently.

Ah I see what you mean, though the argument could be made that people treat the internet like casual verbal communication. There's nothing to preserve because its supposed to be ephemeral.

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#63

Post by CamperBob2 » Fri, Jul 26, 2013, 5:46 AM UTC

Well? He promised "change," didn't he? It changed.

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#64

Post by lostlogin » Fri, Jul 26, 2013, 5:48 AM UTC

lukifer wrote: post #59

true_religion wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm curious. What's un-American about it? I can see the whole "un-internet" aspect, becuase after all "cool urls don't change", but un-American?

In theory, the shared narrative of America is rooted in Enlightenment values, including a respect for reason, education and history. The lack of a proactive attempt to preserve that history, let alone to erase it intentionally, goes against the principles of the Age of Reason. In practice, obviously, this story is at best an ideal we strive for, and that we only achieve partially or intermittently.

Partially, intermittently or accidentally.

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#65

Post by obtino » Fri, Jul 26, 2013, 5:48 AM UTC

Throughout the years of my life I have learned of certain inalienable truths. The fact that politicians are not trust-worthy is one of them.

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#66

Post by ibejoeb » Fri, Jul 26, 2013, 5:49 AM UTC

I think this is sensational, but it got me looking around the archive[1], and it's a pretty good read.

--

Improve Intelligence Capacity and Protect Civil Liberties

* Improve Information Sharing and Analysis: Improve our intelligence system by creating a senior position to coordinate domestic intelligence gathering, establishing a grant program to support thousands more state and local level intelligence analysts, and increasing our capacity to share intelligence across all levels of government.

* Give Real Authority to the Privacy and Civil Liberties Board: Support efforts to strengthen the Privacy and Civil Liberties Board with subpoena powers and reporting responsibilities. Give the Board a robust mandate designed to protect American civil liberties and demand transparency from the Board to ensure accountability.

* Strengthen Institutions to Fight Terrorism: Establish a Shared Security Partnership Program overseas to invest $5 billion over three years to improve cooperation between U.S. and foreign intelligence and law enforcement agencies.

--

He f'ing nailed 2 of those.

[1] http://web.archive.org/web/20130425003939/http://change.gov/...

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#67

Post by Demiurge » Fri, Jul 26, 2013, 5:49 AM UTC

smsm42 wrote: post #55

Demiurge wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about the "change we can believe in"?

If you believed in it back then, you are gullible enough to keep believing in it now.

What you're saying doesn't make any sense to me. Obama said different things than other people said in 2008, including Hillary. It didn't make anyone who believed that Obama meant it gullible, especially looking at his history. And it doesn't AT ALL mean that anyone who believed him then would continue to believe him after he went against his promises.

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#68

Post by Demiurge » Fri, Jul 26, 2013, 5:58 AM UTC

mortehu wrote: post #51

Demiurge wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Has Obama even called Snowden a whistle-blower? He called him a hacker, and his tone of voice has always been dismissive and implying treason.

If I'm not mistaken, he was responding to the question of whether he would put pressure on China to extradite Snowden, and he basically said that he wouldn't scramble jets or start wheeling and dealing for a single case of a 29-year-old hacker suspect. Reading this in the context of what his actual powers and responsibilities are in this case, it seems to me like he was diminishing the crime, rather than rallying for…

Besides not rallying for a witch-hunt, which is of course extremely commendable, he could acknowledge Snowden as a whistle-blower who sacrificed comfort and freedom for protecting constitution. Even while pursuing him for prosecution.

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#69

Post by muuh-gnu » Fri, Jul 26, 2013, 5:59 AM UTC

rtpg wrote: post #50

jussij wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> not because there was some imminent threat to his life. Treason does actually carry the potential of a death penalty. Based on poor state of the current US legal system, I too would have run. The last decade has seen the US legal system turned into nothing but a rubber stamp and puppet for the government. The founding fathers would be turning in their graves.

He isn't going to be charged with treason.

How is he supposed to know in advance that they will not try to kill him if that legal option is on the table and they are known to be willing to make examples out of previous whistleblowers like Bradley Manning?

And even if he is not threatened with outright execution, even slightly less radical but more likely punishments, like that of Manning, are sufficiently radical to justify defecting to the Soviet Union. Even a simple life in some far away Siberian village will be more endurable than a US 24/7 waterboarding & force-feeding facility.

Re: Obama Promises Disappear from Web

#70

Post by foobarbazqux » Fri, Jul 26, 2013, 6:02 AM UTC

hnriot wrote: post #49

fear91 wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A classic psychopathic behaviour. Blind your victim with carefully spun web of lies. Distort the reality and then when the time comes, abuse them. Psychopaths are so good at lying that they self-deceive themselves. They believe their own lies. That's why it's so easy to fall for what they say. They always fly to the top - be it at corporations, governments, crime organizations. The more psychopathic they are, the hig…

Armchair psychology at its best

Freud's ghost hates that expression.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/ahistoryoftheworld/objects/EPqt8An_Sj2i...