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My NSA Records - Submit a FOIA Request or Motion to Quash

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Re: My NSA Records - Submit a FOIA Request or Motion to Quash

#61

Post by dragonwriter »

tsaoutourpants wrote: post #58
doki_pen wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems like the distinction that the NSA is trying to make is that, it's not illegal to possess the data, only to look at it. That argument may even extend to automatic processes that aren't seen by human eyes, who knows. If you happen to get a warrant in the future, you'll be able to "travel back in time" to see all communications of the person in question. The most maddening part of all this is that no one outsid…

Correct that this appears to be their argument, but that argument holds not a chance. Imagine if police searched houses randomly but "weren't allowed to use what they found unless they got a warrant." I believe this argument will be squarely and unanimously rejected by SCOTUS.

> Imagine if police searched houses randomly but "weren't allowed to use what they found unless they got a warrant."

The main remedy for illegal police searches is exclusion of the evidence if, and when, the government attempts to use it in court (and then, usually, only if they attempt to use it against the specific person whose rights were violated by the search, and not always even then [e.g., good faith exception, and other exceptions to the exclusionary rule].)

Re: My NSA Records - Submit a FOIA Request or Motion to Quash

#62

Post by khuey »

chris_mahan wrote: post #40
tsaoutourpants wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are tons of problems with the NSA having this data, and I think they are just beginning to learn that. There's a news headline out there now that a bank robbery suspect has now requested his NSA records to prove he wasn't there. The shit is about to hit the fan (or "additional shit" I should say!) Of course, you could always keep a copy of every phone bill you receive if you want permanent proof of what you wer…

You'd have to prove that it was you talking on the phone. You'd need a recording of the conversation for the judge to be sure.

Reasonable doubt.

Re: My NSA Records - Submit a FOIA Request or Motion to Quash

#63

Post by iamdave »

dsl wrote: post #26
alan_cx wrote: post #5

Only Americans? Or can the rest of us yet to be proven not terrorists apply too?

If you are not American, our laws apply to you, but not our rights. So you are out of luck if you want to file a FOIA.

If you are not American, our laws apply to you

Huh??

Even if someone is physically not in the US? Have I misunderstood something for a very long time?

Re: My NSA Records - Submit a FOIA Request or Motion to Quash

#64

Post by alanh »

tsaoutourpants wrote: post #28
JDGM wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"tsaou...tour pants...???... tsao u to ur pants??? ... ts a out our pan ts... TSA out our pants! Got it!" PS. In submitting this - your Web page (!!) - I was hoping to get some feedback from wise old HNers as to whether it was legit or not. Though the page out of context seems faintly scam-like ("We will mail your request for FREE!" "We've got a lot of printing and mailing to do, and can only do it with your support!…

Thanks for sharing it! If you have any ideas for how to make it seem less sketchy while still conveying that we're going to send a free request for you, let me know!

Well, the big question for me was, “Why would anyone expect either of these options ever actually work?” and your site does not seem to address this fundamental question.

There are a few little things, too, like the ASCII arrow "bullets" and cheap-feeling graphics, that just make it seem less trustworthy. Contact me if you’d like me to donate a wee bit of time to upgrade your look & feel.

Re: My NSA Records - Submit a FOIA Request or Motion to Quash

#65

Post by alanh »

grey-area wrote: post #50
tsaoutourpants wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you!! Help create new awesome buttons and I'll use them! :)

Try something like this perhaps: Retrieve .button { font-family: 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif; text-decoration:none; color:#fff; background-color:green; margin:1em; padding:0.5em 1em; font-size:2em; text-transform:uppercase; letter-spacing:0.1em; } http://jsfiddle.net/zdYbM/

Does feel more modern, but much less clickable. IMO, slight faux 3D effects are still quite helpful on the web

Re: My NSA Records - Submit a FOIA Request or Motion to Quash

#66

Post by alanh »

tsaoutourpants wrote: post #60
rallison wrote: post #56

Note that you can also submit a request directly on the NSA's FOIA page: http://www.nsa.gov/public_info/foia/submit_foia_request/foia...

You could, but I like the idea of them having to deal with a paper copy! :)

IMO, you should state this possibility and your own sentiment directly on your website. Let the people decide!

Re: My NSA Records - Submit a FOIA Request or Motion to Quash

#68

Post by genwin »

tsaoutourpants wrote: post #32
just2n wrote: post #21

The secrecy of the information FOIA is supposed to help alleviate (it doesn't really because it's a catch-22) bothers me a lot. If the government is amassing information on individuals to prove guilt of some crime, by withholding that information from counsel, it's very possible that evidence that proves the individual is completely innocent may be destroyed inadvertently since the individual has no idea what they mi…

There are tons of problems with the NSA having this data, and I think they are just beginning to learn that. There's a news headline out there now that a bank robbery suspect has now requested his NSA records to prove he wasn't there. The shit is about to hit the fan (or "additional shit" I should say!) Of course, you could always keep a copy of every phone bill you receive if you want permanent proof of what you wer…

Your phone bill doesn't tell you your minute-by-minute location. That what the bank robbery suspect wants evidence for.

Re: My NSA Records - Submit a FOIA Request or Motion to Quash

#69

Post by genwin »

chris_mahan wrote: post #40
tsaoutourpants wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are tons of problems with the NSA having this data, and I think they are just beginning to learn that. There's a news headline out there now that a bank robbery suspect has now requested his NSA records to prove he wasn't there. The shit is about to hit the fan (or "additional shit" I should say!) Of course, you could always keep a copy of every phone bill you receive if you want permanent proof of what you wer…

You'd have to prove that it was you talking on the phone. You'd need a recording of the conversation for the judge to be sure.

Presumably the NSA knows his location during the bank robbery, via his cell phone data. He needn't have been talking on the phone at the time. If his location was miles away then he should be off the hook.

Re: My NSA Records - Submit a FOIA Request or Motion to Quash

#70

Post by genwin »

tsaoutourpants wrote: post #28
JDGM wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"tsaou...tour pants...???... tsao u to ur pants??? ... ts a out our pan ts... TSA out our pants! Got it!" PS. In submitting this - your Web page (!!) - I was hoping to get some feedback from wise old HNers as to whether it was legit or not. Though the page out of context seems faintly scam-like ("We will mail your request for FREE!" "We've got a lot of printing and mailing to do, and can only do it with your support!…

Thanks for sharing it! If you have any ideas for how to make it seem less sketchy while still conveying that we're going to send a free request for you, let me know!

Ask for people to tell you if they actually get some good info back. If it happens then put notice of that here on HN. Then I'd be interested.
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