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Giving Up Paying Off $186,000 Student Loan Debt

businessinsider.com

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Re: Giving Up Paying Off $186,000 Student Loan Debt

#61

Post by mc-lovin »

rayiner wrote: post #59
mc-lovin wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a consumer your only duty is to obey they law. However, moral duty is relevant when it comes to how society should think about debt. Everyone has things they would like to do if they had more money. Society should not be arranged to give people a free pass just because they want to do something that requires money.

> However, moral duty is relevant when it comes to how society should think about debt. A debt is a contractual obligation and should be treated as such. One should not moralize contractual obligations. E.g. During the housing crisis, there was a lot of moralizing about homeowners walking away from their underwater mortgages. Moralizing about debt in that way is bullshit. When lenders make a loan secured by collatera…

What I meant was that when designing rules for bankruptcy etc., but also for how education is funded and other things, society has high level goals which are guided by morality.

My point was that when society considers what it's goals are, it should never be a goal that a person should be able to do things that "give their life meaning" when they can't afford them, because ultimately it is a person's own responsibility how they manage their money.

So my post was aimed at people who thought "isn't it horrible that this woman can't do what she wants in life simply because she can't afford it"

Re: Giving Up Paying Off $186,000 Student Loan Debt

#62

Post by larsberg »

danielweber wrote: post #57
larsberg wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My wife and I each came out of our undergrad education with around 50k in college loans. But, we majored in Computer Science and both paid them off within the first two years of working and are now doing quite well . So we're quite comfortable with the trade. That said, you shouldn't need to take those kinds of loans anymore. We went to a top-10 school for CS back when you still had to get loans for them. These days,…

cover any difference between you/your family's ability to pay and the tuition This is good advice, but don't forget that "your ability to pay" is just code for "perfect price discrimination."

Yes, but it's still better than when I went to school. Back then, they took 100% of your parents' savings and all available income, too, but also saddled you with debt while doing it.

I'm firmly of the belief that for the top-tier schools they'd do better just having no tuition and making quarterly reminders of the value of their education, counting on getting it on the flipside from alumni donors down the road.

Re: Giving Up Paying Off $186,000 Student Loan Debt

#64

Post by gangst »

sensibletouches wrote: post #26
gangst wrote: post #2

Son of a bitch that is a lot of debt. It stresses me out just reading about it. I guess few people do the math correctly when they go get a degree. Can anyone here who opted to take a student loan for a technical degree speak to whether it is daunting to them or they are comfortable with the trade?

For realistic people, it's not that big of a deal and speaks more to how people value money and things. However, I'll admit that I wish, as a 22 year-old kid, I was more knowledgeable about all those loan papers I was signing at the time. I'm a doctor who had about $160,000 in student loan debt by the time I finished residency (during which I paid $1,000/month on a $45,000/year salary and lived like a student). After…

Out of curiosity, what brought you to HN? While not riding the tech train professionally, have you considered investing in or starting any products?

Re: Giving Up Paying Off $186,000 Student Loan Debt

#65

Post by danielweber »

larsberg wrote: post #62
danielweber wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

cover any difference between you/your family's ability to pay and the tuition This is good advice, but don't forget that "your ability to pay" is just code for "perfect price discrimination."

Yes, but it's still better than when I went to school. Back then, they took 100% of your parents' savings and all available income, too, but also saddled you with debt while doing it. I'm firmly of the belief that for the top-tier schools they'd do better just having no tuition and making quarterly reminders of the value of their education, counting on getting it on the flipside from alumni donors down the road.

I agree, but don't forget that for the top-tier schools, a substantial fraction of their students come from families that are loaded.

Re: Giving Up Paying Off $186,000 Student Loan Debt

#66

Post by dragonwriter »

larsberg wrote: post #62
danielweber wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

cover any difference between you/your family's ability to pay and the tuition This is good advice, but don't forget that "your ability to pay" is just code for "perfect price discrimination."

Yes, but it's still better than when I went to school. Back then, they took 100% of your parents' savings and all available income, too, but also saddled you with debt while doing it. I'm firmly of the belief that for the top-tier schools they'd do better just having no tuition and making quarterly reminders of the value of their education, counting on getting it on the flipside from alumni donors down the road.

> I'm firmly of the belief that for the top-tier schools they'd do better just having no tuition and making quarterly reminders of the value of their education, counting on getting it on the flipside from alumni donors down the road.

At least when I went to school 20+ years ago, the very top-tier private schools were very close to that, having large endowments and using them for both merit-based and need-based financial aid in grant form, so that most students paid substantially less than the nominal tuition, and quite a lot of students paid very little to no tuition (and often were subsidized for books and housing, too), such that for most students they were less expensive than nominally cheaper less-elite schools.

Re: Giving Up Paying Off $186,000 Student Loan Debt

#67

Post by cityzen »

pragone wrote: post #15

I thought this article was going to be somewhat insightful as to another option for me, as, like many others, I have quite a bit of student loans. Including interest, I owe about $250k (BS and MS). I don't regret going to the school I went to - the experience and what I went through there was life changing for me; however, it does put a severe stranglehold on what I am actually able to do in life right now. I am basi…

I don't follow... how does having student loans put a stranglehold on your ability to set off on your own? Saying you're "forced" to work for others seems a little dramatic. Self employment isn't about working in your PJs as much as it is about being on the hustle every day (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5betFZRICVg). There will always be a million and one reasons why working for yourself is harder than having a job, if it's not student loans it will be something else (age, family, etc). You have to look past that.

Re: Giving Up Paying Off $186,000 Student Loan Debt

#69

Post by cityzen »

pragone wrote: post #15

I thought this article was going to be somewhat insightful as to another option for me, as, like many others, I have quite a bit of student loans. Including interest, I owe about $250k (BS and MS). I don't regret going to the school I went to - the experience and what I went through there was life changing for me; however, it does put a severe stranglehold on what I am actually able to do in life right now. I am basi…

I'll also add that I do understand what you're saying. I have been self employed for 16 years and my wife worked as well so there was somewhat of a cushion. Back in 2008, though, my first son was born 3 months premature and I had this "oh shit" moment where I thought, "ok, wife isn't working, I have a sick baby, we have a mortgage and two car payments, there is no way this is going to end well". I stepped up my hustle big time and five years later we have two kids, very little debt and things are fine. You really just have to take look at the glass as half full. As a software engineer, you're in a sellers market. There are SO many companies out there looking for people like you, you just don't realize it yet.

Either way, best of luck. If you do want to strike out on your own, please don't wait until you're "comfortable" because it will be too late.

Re: Giving Up Paying Off $186,000 Student Loan Debt

#70

Post by rollo_tommasi »

kefka wrote: post #47

Wow. She can cry me a damn river. She HAS a degree. She HAD a 6 figure job that she quit because it was "too hard" She still HAS debt. Me? That's right. Injured, under Voc rehab. I'm going to a 2 bit state school (drafting, cad). Right now, I can't afford the GAS to get to and from school. Voc rehab (state agency) will pay for it, only after a 6 week wait. And I don't have the money. What I'd need is a few hundred to…

It's not coming, because the business media intentionally uses articles like this in order to pit the members of struggling underclass against each other (and it doesn't matter what your job title is, if you have >$100,000 in non-dischargeable debt you are a serf).
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