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Buyer sued for posting factual negative review on eBay

popehat.com

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Re: Buyer sued for posting factual negative review on eBay

#61

Post by mnarayan01 »

The feedback in question [1] appears to be a one star rating on a $175.00 item where $1.44 postage was required. I would guess that the seller's complaint is on the one star rating, not the message content (and on this I tend to agree with them -- the buyer is being a huge ass). That said, the one star is clearly an opinion, and thus not subject to slander laws.

1: http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&...

Edit: I would also note that while generally I think popehat does good work, the part around "Mr. Amodio responded with an open, contemptuous, and contemptible threat to abuse the legal system" is...not so good; the following quote does not come from Mr. Amodio and does not contain anything obvious that would indicate either an open or contemptuous threat to abuse the legal system.

Re: Buyer sued for posting factual negative review on eBay

#62

Post by Karunamon »

joahua wrote: post #24
jvdh wrote: post #8

This seems like a very unfair situation for the company. Think about what would happen if this were the other way around. For example, buyer returns an article, sends it through the post, and for some reason it ends up at Med Express door with postage due. They leave a negative feedback on eBay about the user. The Internet would then also be up in arms about the company, 'abusing' its position to harm an underdog use…

The notion that negative feedback ought somehow only be posted in event of egregious misdescription is a bizarre, Ebay-centric one. It was a bad customer experience - of course her response is negative! eBay have designed it this way, but many users probably aren't aware of the consequences of leaving feedback. You'd write a complaint card in a hotel with nary a second thought and no ill consequences. To be sued for…

>The notion that negative feedback ought somehow only be posted in event of egregious misdescription is a bizarre, Ebay-centric one.

When you keep in mind the effect bad feedback has on a seller, you really should stay your hand unless you feel they were really out to screw you (or you're just plain vindictive).

It's a buck in shipping. I'd pay it, blast them an email asking WTF, maybe leave a neutral at worst. Bad feedback is reserved for fraud, IMHO.

Then again, the seller in this case appears to be a litigious asshat, so fire away.

Re: Buyer sued for posting factual negative review on eBay

#63

Post by yebyen »

pi18n wrote: post #55

This is the sort of frivolous lawsuit that makes a complete mockery of legitimate torts. There needs to be some way to make courts award damages to the defendant in ridiculous cases without making it difficult for small parties to sue large ones over legitimate grievances.

Frivolous like posting a 1 star rating because the seller required you to pay $1.44 in shipping to complete the transaction? I'm not sure it's the lawsuit that's frivolous.

Re: Buyer sued for posting factual negative review on eBay

#64

Post by ScottWhigham »

Karunamon wrote: post #60

Negging someone on eBay for a buck in shipping is a pretty crappy thing to do, but then taking the other guy to court over the feedback is even worse. There are no winners in this situation.

The seller made sure that there would be no winners in this situation when they sent the item with insufficient postage. If that doesn't happen, the rest of this likely does not happen.

"Negging someone on eBay for a buck in shipping is a pretty crappy thing to do"

That's just not true - that may be your opinion but that's the opinion of a very small number of people. The majority - an overwhelming majority - believe that it one valuable part of such community feedback systems to provide a way for buyers to notify other perspective buyers of potential problems.

Re: Buyer sued for posting factual negative review on eBay

#65

Post by ScottWhigham »

Aardwolf wrote: post #27

I think this is a problem with eBay. For some reason, sellers desperately need and want your good feedback, and a single bad feedback, even for something as tiny as a $1.44 postage stamp, seems to have a very bad impact on the seller. In real life, one bad review about something like this on someone with a good track record doesn't hurt the slightest bit. Why does it hurt so much in the eBay review system, and can't…

What you see as a problem, I see as a positive. This is clearly an edge case - it's not the norm by far. The norm is that sellers make darn sure that their product is "as advertised" so that they've set the expectations correctly. This results in higher feedback for the seller. Sure, you have some slime ball sellers there who say, "Give me 5 stars!" but that, again, is not the norm.

Re: Buyer sued for posting factual negative review on eBay

#66

Post by Karunamon »

ScottWhigham wrote: post #64
Karunamon wrote: post #60

Negging someone on eBay for a buck in shipping is a pretty crappy thing to do, but then taking the other guy to court over the feedback is even worse. There are no winners in this situation.

The seller made sure that there would be no winners in this situation when they sent the item with insufficient postage. If that doesn't happen, the rest of this likely does not happen. "Negging someone on eBay for a buck in shipping is a pretty crappy thing to do" That's just not true - that may be your opinion but that's the opinion of a very small number of people. The majority - an overwhelming majority - believe…

>That's just not true

Yes it is. I can forgive someone for being ignorant of the way the eBay feedback system works, but when you push that button, you are not just "notifying other perspective buyers of potential problems". It hasn't been that way for years. Not since eBay removed the ability to leave negative feedback for buyers, anyways.

If I were the seller in this case, rather than going to court, and negative feedback was still around, I'd have left them the same with something like "PITA buyer, - feedback for being off $1 in shipping. AVOID."

What you are actually doing when negging a seller is deciding "This seller made me so mad that I am going to cost them large amounts of reputation, raise their fees, restrict their ability to list, and possibly help drive them out of business". This is not an idle threat. Feedback is calculated over a 12 moth period, meaning if you only sell a couple things a year and get a single neg, you'll trip over all of the eBay restrictions and fee increases.

Now let's get some perspective here. The seller delivered the item, as described. There are no complaints about the item itself, so we can assume the buyer is happy with it.

Buyer's willing to mark the whole transaction as terrible over a freaking dollar?

There are some levels of shenanigans to which this is an appropriate response. $1 is not.

The more I think about it, the more I think there may be some merit to this case. If the seller offered to make the problem right and the buyer hit them anyways, given the effect that hit will have, is it possible they have a case?

Re: Buyer sued for posting factual negative review on eBay

#67

Post by claudius »

Karunamon wrote: post #66
ScottWhigham wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The seller made sure that there would be no winners in this situation when they sent the item with insufficient postage. If that doesn't happen, the rest of this likely does not happen. "Negging someone on eBay for a buck in shipping is a pretty crappy thing to do" That's just not true - that may be your opinion but that's the opinion of a very small number of people. The majority - an overwhelming majority - believe…

>That's just not true Yes it is. I can forgive someone for being ignorant of the way the eBay feedback system works, but when you push that button, you are not just "notifying other perspective buyers of potential problems". It hasn't been that way for years. Not since eBay removed the ability to leave negative feedback for buyers, anyways. If I were the seller in this case, rather than going to court, and negative f…

> Buyer's willing to mark the whole transaction as terrible over a freaking dollar?

Why not? The proper course of action (provided the buyer didn’t mind waiting for the delivery) would have been to reject paying said $1.44 and let the seller try to ship again. By then, the delivery certainly would have been late, easily justifying negative feedback.

Furthermore, the seller even acknowledges that this particular problem happened a lot lately[1], so they really have no excuse whatsoever for underpaying their shipments.

Oh, and it may be a good idea to think about what ‘-’ means – to me, it doesn’t mean ‘terrible’ but ‘there was a problem’, and postage due is a problem (as is late delivery). I don’t want to buy from people who deliver late/with postage due and I am happy if ebay ensures that people delivering late or trying to get another $1.44 from me are stopped from selling on the platform.

[1] http://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&... ‘Sorry- no idea there was postage due. This has happened alot from USPS lately.’.

Re: Buyer sued for posting factual negative review on eBay

#68

Post by cykod »

Karunamon wrote: post #66
ScottWhigham wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The seller made sure that there would be no winners in this situation when they sent the item with insufficient postage. If that doesn't happen, the rest of this likely does not happen. "Negging someone on eBay for a buck in shipping is a pretty crappy thing to do" That's just not true - that may be your opinion but that's the opinion of a very small number of people. The majority - an overwhelming majority - believe…

>That's just not true Yes it is. I can forgive someone for being ignorant of the way the eBay feedback system works, but when you push that button, you are not just "notifying other perspective buyers of potential problems". It hasn't been that way for years. Not since eBay removed the ability to leave negative feedback for buyers, anyways. If I were the seller in this case, rather than going to court, and negative f…

If instead of showing up at my door I got a note that said you need to come down to the post office during business hours and pick up your package and bring an extra $1.44, I'd actually be kinda put out.

This was a mistake by the shipper for mis-weighing the package (as they note in the feedback "This has happened alot from USPS lately." - maybe they need to get themselves a new scale) it should get negative feedback, and if this is the tactic they take to get rid of that negative feedback, then that seller shouldn't be selling.

Re: Buyer sued for posting factual negative review on eBay

#69

Post by mcherm »

MDCore wrote: post #52
claudius wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> something outside the seller's control It depends. For me, the seller is fully responsible for shipping, and any added postage, while well outside the seller’s control, is attributed to the seller. I also do not want the seller to correct an error, I want the seller not to make an error. If you fail at that, I will leave bad feedback, and if it causes you to go out of business, I couldn’t care less. Do your job bet…

> If you fail at that, I will leave bad feedback, and if it causes you to go out of business, I couldn’t care less. Do your job better next time. Wow. One small mistake and they should go out of business. Are you treated that way in your job?

Accurately stating that the seller failed to cover $1.44 of postage is a VALID reason to leave bad feedback.

It is not a valid reason to put someone out of business. If eBay chooses to put someone out of business over a one-line review that reveals a $1.44 oversight, then eBay is the culprit here, not the complainant. The person complaining shouldn't have to care: it's not their fault that others are overreacting.

Re: Buyer sued for posting factual negative review on eBay

#70

Post by jonaldomo »

Aardwolf wrote: post #27

I think this is a problem with eBay. For some reason, sellers desperately need and want your good feedback, and a single bad feedback, even for something as tiny as a $1.44 postage stamp, seems to have a very bad impact on the seller. In real life, one bad review about something like this on someone with a good track record doesn't hurt the slightest bit. Why does it hurt so much in the eBay review system, and can't…

I think this could be solved with community reviews of reviews. Although it is factual mistakes happen. Example, did the buyer make good on it? Is this a pattern? If the public could vote up or down on reviews to increase or decrease the weight of the rating this would be a non issue.
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