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New York becomes the first state to impose a data center moratorium

reuters.com

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Re: New York becomes the first state to impose a data center moratorium

#61

Post by allthetime »

int32_64 wrote: post #57

I have a family member that wants to ban all data centers and I felt like Daniel Plainview in the milkshake scene showing them the AWS region selector interface, explaining that regional data center bans in deep leftist areas won't move the needle. Nothing short of a totalitarian one world government can stop the development of AI technology, there's simply too much demand. It's just not happening. These people shoul…

A lot of us would be happy with them being more heavily taxed on consumption and that money going directly to making everyone’s utility bills much cheaper. Being forced to create more capacity would also be great.

Re: New York becomes the first state to impose a data center moratorium

#62

Post by freejazz »

afavour wrote: post #50
newaccountman2 wrote: post #14

[flagged]

> People in red state have been voting to shit on the environment for longer than I have been alive, Red states still have a significant population that don't vote Republican and they're more often than not the ones who bear the brunt of negatives like data center construction.

Yeah! It really sucks. Still, what should NY do of that?

Re: New York becomes the first state to impose a data center moratorium

#63

Post by allthetime »

orangedog wrote: post #13
cmiles8 wrote: post #5

Small town politics generally fly below the radar but this is a real hot button issue in a growing number of communities. Town meetings are dominated by residents lacking the room for otherwise sleeping zoning hearings that nobody attends. Folks don’t want data centers in their town and they’re increasingly successful in chasing developers out. Outside the bubble of tech the attitude towards AI and everything associa…

Recent survey showed on HN that 60% of adults in the US dislike it which means that 40% either don't care or like it 40 is a massive number, you're not that far from a coin flip. I don't think any of us have a good read on how people feel because the vocal people are very vocal. Here on HN you'd guess everybody hates it or loves it and there are a bunch of us like me that just view it as a tool with consequences that…

I love AI assisted learning and code generation - absolutely despise AI “art” though - image, music, written word, video. If AI was just being used to get shit done efficiently, what a dream that would be, instead we are generating infinite mountains of useless bytes to suck people’s brains out in TikTok feeds and annihilate access to original thoughts in a Google search.

Re: New York becomes the first state to impose a data center moratorium

#64

Post by EA-3167 »

jeffbee wrote: post #51
cmiles8 wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah no. Almost everything people are pushing back against is branded as AI data center expansion. Moving to the cloud doesn’t need net new data centers being build… that’s just workloads moving from one data center to another.

Obviously you're welcome to whatever beliefs comfort you, but most data centers that are anywhere near anyone are not related to AI, largely because AI applications are not very sensitive to latency and don't need to be near users. The specific one in Hayward I mentioned is advertised for corporate IT, as is another one in Pittsburg (California). Anyway the projects should not be adjudicated based on what happens ins…

You’re clearly ignoring the context of “new and rapidly built” and are instead using the metric of all data centers in existence.

You’re technically correct, but missing the point and imo arguing more or less with yourself only.

Re: New York becomes the first state to impose a data center moratorium

#65

Post by embedding-shape »

kyledrake wrote: post #54

A lot of people run production, non-AI servers out of New York data centers. This will be a serious problem for a lot of people, including smaller companies, when they can't expand capacity in New York anymore and prices for what's left start going through the roof. It's not always easy to move servers to other data centers, not everything is an eventually consistent database.

Are you one of them? The other side of the issue is "raising power costs, straining water supplies and burdening local communities" according to the article. I guess the crux is figuring out who would suffer the most, data center expanders/builders, or the local community? If the latter, then this move seems right from my point of view, but I'm also not building/managing data centers.

I think it's reasonable to pump the brakes for a year (which is what they've done) and then see where things are in a year, even when there is just a risk to the local community. Worst case scenario, those businesses and data centers end up one year behind schedule, compared to the downsides, that seems acceptable to me.

Re: New York becomes the first state to impose a data center moratorium

#66

Post by otterley »

kyledrake wrote: post #54

A lot of people run production, non-AI servers out of New York data centers. This will be a serious problem for a lot of people, including smaller companies, when they can't expand capacity in New York anymore and prices for what's left start going through the roof. It's not always easy to move servers to other data centers, not everything is an eventually consistent database.

It only applies to DCs > 50MW.

Re: New York becomes the first state to impose a data center moratorium

#67

Post by freejazz »

int32_64 wrote: post #57

I have a family member that wants to ban all data centers and I felt like Daniel Plainview in the milkshake scene showing them the AWS region selector interface, explaining that regional data center bans in deep leftist areas won't move the needle. Nothing short of a totalitarian one world government can stop the development of AI technology, there's simply too much demand. It's just not happening. These people shoul…

> areas won't move the needle

Wont move the needle? Go ahead and build shit in your community, I'm happy its being kept out of mine. Stop trying to pretend like NY is trying to legislate the nation by maintaining its own front and backyard.

Re: New York becomes the first state to impose a data center moratorium

#68

Post by bklosky »

Regardless of your personal feelings about AI, this is pretty clumsy regulation that will just cause Tiebout sorting away from NY. If there are negative externalities, tax 'em, use the proceeds for some feel-good social programming, and let the data center builders internalize the costs...

Re: New York becomes the first state to impose a data center moratorium

#69

Post by weberer »

piltdownman wrote: post #52
ecshafer wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

many of the data centers are being built with natural gas generators on site, and they are using excess gas from the oil drilling.

Texas is the only state in the lower 48 that has no major connections to neighboring power grids. That means growing energy demand in Texas must be met by new power generation in Texas. Texas has not improved energy efficiency standards since the 2021 blackout, and have resisted all attempts at increasing the governance of the gas generation. The Electric Reliability Council of Texas' "Capacity, Demand and Reserves r…

>in a climate where passive-cooling isn't viable

Chips can also be water cooled, and Texas borders an endless supply of water in the Gulf of America.

Re: New York becomes the first state to impose a data center moratorium

#70

Post by khurs »

dylan604 wrote: post #60
khurs wrote: post #31

>The state currently has more than 130 data centers, according to Data Center Map, compared with more than 600 in Virginia and about 500 in Texas. Texas is physically larger and 'business frienedly' so suspect they will be getting a lot more. Taylor Sheridan can do a new series where a Ranch owned by a family for many generations is targeted by a Datacentre company.

Taylor Sheridan's movie studio is on land that was once a ranch

Really? How ironic
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