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Linux and Secure Boot certificate expiration (2025)

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Re: Linux and Secure Boot certificate expiration (2025)

#61

How do desktop Linux distros avoid attackers from rolling back the operating system to a vulnerable, but signed version?

This is not an issue specific to Linux, Windows installations can be downgraded as well. As for the mechanism, UEFI devices, alongside key updates, also get revocation list updates.

Re: Linux and Secure Boot certificate expiration (2025)

#62

How do desktop Linux distros avoid attackers from rolling back the operating system to a vulnerable, but signed version?

This is not an issue specific to Linux, Windows installations can be downgraded as well. As for the mechanism, UEFI devices, alongside key updates, also get revocation list updates.

Strangely I feel like I've never seen one of these. It would be needed after every major kernel / user land exploit. It would also need rollback protection on the motherboard itself so you couldn't just remove the updated keys / revocations.

Re: Linux and Secure Boot certificate expiration (2025)

#63
post #18

Last time I installed Arch, I put Secure Boot in setup mode and enrolled by own keys. The idea of using someone else's keys seems absurd.

Do note that being able to completely remove MS keys is highly dependent on your mainboard. Not in the sense of if they allow you to do it (I think most if not all DIY boards allow you to), but if you will be able to boot afterwards.

I (soft?)bricked a mainboard and it doesn't want to boot anymore after I removed the MS keys. The worst part is, that it has a dualBIOS and no active switch to change between them, only their own "I'll change when I see issues"... well you can guess how well that worked out (and I am not able to get it to clear CMOS for some reason).

Re: Linux and Secure Boot certificate expiration (2025)

#65
post #2

They left out the steps to update it. I made a rough attempt at a document for this. [1] Please let me know if I missed a validation step. I have done this on six machines but they were all Linux. Not tested on BSD. Archive [2] in the event I was too aggressive in blocking bots. [Edit] I should also include this [3] thread for completeness sake. Some people people were playing with a shim work around but it looks lik…

More recent archive [1]

[1] - https://archive.is/dPFuq

Re: Linux and Secure Boot certificate expiration (2025)

#66
post #50
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Existing systems are going to continue to boot. The expiry date is enforced for signing new binaries, not for deciding whether an already signed binary is allowed to boot (barring buggy firmware). https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/72892.html (Secure boot certificate rollover is real but probably won't hurt you) https://wiki.debian.org/SecureBoot/CAChanges#OMG.21.21.21_Wi...

> he expiry date is enforced for signing new binaries Does this means that updating my system kernel would fail or even break boot?

No, distros uses a shim binary that is less likely to need updates. If that shim needs an update (only signed with the new key) then we get into a situation where old machines will fail to boot it.

Re: Linux and Secure Boot certificate expiration (2025)

#67
post #33
post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, fair enough. Well Firefox should support Brotli by default, so it's probably something going on on my machine.

Nothing wrong with that. I think people should be able to disable anything they want. I doubt any commercial sites will do what I am doing. I use that little blog to test all manor of unorthodox things. That's why I listed the archive mirror, just in case.

I've seen commercial sites hard-code gzip content in all their responses regardless of the Accept headings. Probably just as fair to use Brotli these days.

Similarly, I've been using zopfli (gzip/unzip compatible) for png compression after quantization for db storage from 2-color (B/W) scans as it's directly compatible to the browser but winds up about 1/6 the original sized tiff. Not the best compression, had a discussion for a better compression, but required a wasm renderer to decompress as it isn't in the browser box.

Re: Linux and Secure Boot certificate expiration (2025)

#69
post #50
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Existing systems are going to continue to boot. The expiry date is enforced for signing new binaries, not for deciding whether an already signed binary is allowed to boot (barring buggy firmware). https://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/72892.html (Secure boot certificate rollover is real but probably won't hurt you) https://wiki.debian.org/SecureBoot/CAChanges#OMG.21.21.21_Wi...

> he expiry date is enforced for signing new binaries Does this means that updating my system kernel would fail or even break boot?

Shim, the first stage bootloader on Linux, is designed to be updated infrequently. Distributions embed their own signing certificate in it and have that binary signed by Microsoft. The actual bootloader (typically either grub or systemd-boot) is then signed with the distribution certificate, as is the kernel. Distributions get to set their own policy around how long that certificate lasts for, it's entirely unrelated to the Microsoft certificate expiry.

Re: Linux and Secure Boot certificate expiration (2025)

#70

I'm surprised more people aren't freaking out about this. It seems likely a whole lot of Linux machines are going to fail to reboot in the next few months. The problem affects VMs too. I was grateful Proxmox put a little warning in its hypervisor GUI with a button to press to fix the BIOS of its VMs. Secure Boot has been deeply broken for years, not providing meaningful security on most consumer machines.

Why has it been broken? I’m running secure boot on all my machines with my own certs. It works fine. Whatever ms and hp / Lenovo do with their certs doesn’t affect me, since I only have my certs installed. Except on a single machine whose purpose is running windows, but it’s not on the critical path for my job.

numerous vulnerabilities in secure boot deployment over many years. e.g. https://arstechnica.com/security/2024/09/secure-boot-neuteri...
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